Ive been saying for a while that one of the reasons we arent producing the volume of quality backs as forwards is a direct result of clubs loading their benches with forwards.

The only chance kids get at 1-7 is when there are injuries or a brave coach as those positions in the main are expected to do the full 80.

In this way its harder to blood youngsters as forwards can be rotated if they are struggling in a game wheras backs are left in the firing line.

I would add just 1 more sub - keep the number of interchanges the same and designate 2 forward 8-13 and 2 back subs 1-7 with a utility sub who could play 1-13.

If just 2 of those subs were acadamy trained under 23 year olds it would be a start.

Was going to suggest this, only I would suggest 2 of the subs must be under 21.

But you could always put limits on the bench, as has been suggested.

Or we can just stop making up stupid contrived ideas and leave it as it is.

Here here. If coaches could come up with a new innovation since the 'impact hooker', then all the benches wouldn't look the same, and nobody would come up with...questionable ideas.

Does that mean you are leaving the forums?

I've not read all the thread.

I would have six on the bench, two who must be 21 or under and no interchanges.

So, the six on the bench would just be spectators? Surely they'd be more comfortable in the stand?

The other way is to return to competitive scrums. This would create a game of different shapes and sizes as props & second rowers would have to bulk up to push in the scrum (but be mobile, like Carl Webb or Keiron Cunningham). That would create a more varied and create game where little men could use skills to exploit gaps without merely running one out from dummyhalf. Benches would need cover for forwards, backs and playmakers.

I thought that!

The idea of 6 is good i feel but only 4 of these should be able to be used during the game with 12 interchanges.

Yeah, and we could maybe have 15 players on the pitch, to get more people involved, maybe reward good kicking with some way to compete for the ball when kicked in touch. What would be even better would be a mass of rules that the punters know nothing about, so that the ref can make about six calls and then award a penalty every few minutes - since there'll be more penalties we should increase their value to 3pts...

4 Subs is plenty, its supposed to be a game of tactics and stamina not a friendly exhibition match.

Impact Hooker must be a Super League innovation.

Competative scrums are a thing of the past, and even the RFU are going to get rid of them eventually.

They are dangerous parts of the game, singularly the biggest risk to a player in the game.

AFAICT (from research, and [url=http://scholar.google.com/Google Scholar[/url provides a useful academic research tool) the injury risk due to scrums is largely due to the hit when packs come together, the hit or 'engage'. While the IRB added a touch call where opposing props tap each other to ready for the hit, the RFU's scrum coach has suggested the hit be removed from the Rugby scrum - i.e. the scrums should link together first before pushing. That would have the positive knock on effect of eliminating injuries due to scrum collapses (as there wouldn't be the same expenditure of force in the hit). In RL, a significant number of shoulder, neck and back injuries are recorded - they are sustained by collisions in the tackle. Do we outlaw tackling from RL?

If anything, if RL's 6 man scrums were packed in a clean way like RU's are now ( as opposed to the messy set of the past), they would be less risky than RU because a smaller packweight would lead to smaller forces being exerted on frontrowers. The RFU (& the other leading European 5 Nations) have no plans to get rid of the scrum, and steadfastly preserved its importance in Union - even when nations like Australia were trying to promote a brand of Rugby which minimised the importance and prominence of scrummaging.

Past players like Arthur Beetson and Tommy Raudonikis keep calling for the return of contested scrummaging, a tradition the game had for decades. While the game's authorities in both hemispheres have sought to speed up and slow down the game artificially through a number of measures to either open the game up or make it a contest, both to allow creative attacking play. Either through varying interchange (6 subs, unlimited, unlimited with 2 permanent replacements, 12 substitutions, 10 substitutions), altering ruck speed & the play the ball to swing advantage to the tackler or attacker. Both these are linear solutions that to & fro without addressing the fundamental architecture of the game needs to be addressed.

You knew what I meant.

Once substituted, no going back on in the game.



Lets bring stamina back into the game.

Tke it you dont play then...

You want 6 subs, why not have an offence team and defence team?

Has anyone else thought that its just two more players that our league hasn't got?I agree. 4 subs, 6 changes would be my choice.

But wasn' it originally a stupid contrived of having substitutes in the first place?

Nowt wrong wi playin with 11 men or less after several had a couple of limbs broken or face put out of joint.

Them boys woz 'ARD not like the dying swans of today who want replacing when their tatoos gets touched

Have you got something against Feka or something