An away crowd

are you under the impression NL1 and NL2 are the same thing?

You didn't say that

This is what you said




Away you go

Are you really trying to argue there is a meaningful difference between saying

[iNL1 and NL2 arent the same thing[/i

and

[iNL1 and NL2 are different things[/i

are you asking what the differences between NL1 and NL2 are? surely you already know that Starry, one is NL1 and one is NL2, one is the 2nd tier of RFL pyramid one is the 3rd, one is made up of generally bigger clubs than the other, one is a bigger competition than the other, one has better attendances than the other, one has a higher profile than the other, one is in general a bigger league than the other

That's not what you said, you said NL1 and NL2 are very different things, which is not the same as saying they're different things. Lions and tigers are different things but they're not very different things

Stop changing what you posted

You did not post that NL1 and NL 2 are different things

You posted that NL 1 clubs are very[idifferent[/i to NL 2 clubs

Now the thing is ALL clubs be they IN NL 1,NL2 , SL , NRL or elite 1 are different

But to try to make an argument that there is some fundamental difference between NL1 and NL 2 clubs that in some way would effect Toulouse is just bloody stupid

Especially as over the next 3 years Toulouse could potentially play against 4 of the clubs presently in NL 2 NOW and 2 clubs that only a few weeks ago were in NL2

You have also made much in the past of there being a definate major difference between SL and the NL's , but no real difference between NL 1 and NL 2

what a pathetic argument, very, is a completely subjective deliberately none specific word, or could either of you tell me the official level at which very can be applied?

Starbug, i never said there was a major difference between NL1 and NL2 clubs, you need to learn to read what is actually there and not what your desperate to be there

to try and make an argument that there is no fundemental difference between the 2nd and 3rd tiers is idiotic, even for your standards, its down at the likes of barnacle bill or bustinyaballs level, it would take an almost subhuman intellect to think there is no fundemental difference between the two different leagues,

the differences in size, popularity, exposure of NL1 compared to NL2 is huge, not the size of the difference between NL1 and SL, but still pretty large, this will be integral to the financing, funding, and chance of success of the Toulouse project, it would be a negative towards the potential of success for Toulouse for them to have to play in that league for a year,

and you would see that it is the sensible option to put Toulouse in NL1 and not allow them to drop to NL2 if you werent desperate to prove everything is bent so you can perpetuate your conspiracy and dont have to accept Leigh werent good enough

according to you Toulouse will be like a cancer in NL1, dragging support and the credibility of the league downwards because they only aim to use that league to get out of it into a higher league, yet in NL2 Toulouse would be doing exactly the same, you seem positive about putting them in NL2, a league full of clubs with a bit less support, a bit less money and a bit less able to deal with impact you believe Toulouse will have, therefore the clubs in that league will feel the hit much much more,

so by any logical conclusion you would agree Toulouse should be in NL1 rather than NL2, if not for any benefit for Toulouse, but as an altruistic fraternal gesture to your NL2 brothers, or could the more likely be true, and as is common with the people who generally agree with you, and you dont really give a flying f@ck about NL2, you dont give a flying f@ck about the game, and dont give a flying f@ck about the game outside of Leigh, and you decisions and opinions arent formed by judging whats in the best interests of the game, but the best interests of Leigh, and when we read your opinions it is always in the knowledge that if you were honest with yourself, you would choose leigh over the game everytime, and would even be in favour of doing something that wasnt in the games best interests (and would in fact be a negative for the game) as long as it benefitted Leigh Centaurions

If the NL1 clubs allow the inclusion of Toulouse to be a success by using it as a positive selling point for media, sponsors, spectators and players it will be a success. If they spend their time saying how terrible it is, bitching about the quota & relegation exemptions, complaining about away fans & travel costs; the decision to admit Toulouse will be seen as a mistake.

I wonder whether the NL1 chairmen want to make it a success, or whether some want a failure to make the RFL look stupid?

So you substitute [imajor[/i for [ivery[/i and you think that makes a difference to what you posted

You posted that NL1 clubs are very different to NL 2 clubs

They are not ,

Almost all are part time , thier relative attendances apart from 1 or 2 are very similar

Yes the ' bigger ' clubs in NL1 are better on a playing front than the clubs at the bottom of NL 2 and yet sometimes those teams do give the top teams a difficult time

I would hazard a guess that every NL club be they NL 1 or NL 2 are propped up financially by thier owners [ Not a single NL club is capable of breaking even on what most would term earned income

Yes Toulouse will be better off in NL1 than NL 2 , that is obvious

In the same way that a NL club would most likely be better off in SL if they had as much if not more money than the other SL clubs

Not exactly rocket science

Toulouse will not be a ' cancer ' in NL 1 , I have never stated that , 3 clubs will possibly suffer from thier inclusion as some of the fans of those 3 clubs will see thier club possibly miss out on a franchise in 2012

The other 7 clubs will be unaffected [ until one of those clubs finish above Toulouse but is still relegated

But none of these 10 clubs will gain anything from having Toulouse in NL 1

As far as NL 2 goes , well there will be no benifit to them

You state that I care little if nothing about any club outside the one I support , your perogative

Strange then that I communicate with fans of other clubs looking at ways that I can help them raise monies for thier clubs by doing various things we have done at Leigh

I have suggested various things like ' Home ' clubs paying coach travel to bring more away fans to matches and how the NL clubs both 1 and 2 should be looking at using one kit supplier to improve buying power [ something that the ' lesser ' NL 2 clubs would most benifit from , but I only share and discuss with fans of other NL clubs

I have accepted that the club I support will never play in SL again and can see that the competition we do play in needs to be strong or eventually the club I support will suffer

You say I dont care about the game as a whole , your perogative , I have little interest in the game above NL level because it doesn't need any of my help but below it I have much interest and have done much to help the game at amatuer level


And finally the pedantic part Leigh Centaurions

Maybe they will play the 1 st GF on Venus

So you think that the clubs in NL 1 will be able to pull more sponsorship and get more fans through the turnstiles because of the inclusion of Toulouse

You are in dreamland , it is a no win situation , if Toulouse do well on the pitch the fans will see it as they are being allowed to flout the salary cap and quota rules , if they do badly and potentially end up in a relegation place the fans will question why they have been allowed in NL 1 instead of starting in NL2

And all this is costing the RFL close to a million pounds over the 3 years

And yet every NL club is struggling to survive

well i did that because a sentence saying, [ii never said there was a very difference between NL1 and NL2 clubs[/i
wouldnt make sense



for the third time, no i didnt, you can clearly read, so i have no idea why you have decided the word [iclubs[/i is there when it clearly isnt,

there is big differences between NL1 and NL2, not least one being the 2nd tier and one the 3rd, which will make a huge difference to Toulouses ability to sell themselves to the french



and as such it would be idiotic to put them in NL2,



yes, anybody would be better off if you gave them a bit of money, but no one has suggested anything like this, so it seems strange you bring it up


pretty random though,



so they wont lose anything, suffer no ill affects, and get £100k from the RFL every year, what on earth do you have to moan about?

other than maybe Toulouse being given the same opportunity as Leigh to get promoted, and your scared they will prepare better than you

mainly because they wont be in NL2, but even if they were it would (according to you) have no effect whatsoever, yet you still moan



you must be very proud of yourself



strange then the only negative to Toulouses inclusion is they may stop some clubs getting a SL place in the future, but at least one of those you know isnt anywhere near ready, yet still you moan




seems odd how much time you spend moaning about what SL does then?

but you have just said the NLs will suffer no ill effects because of Toulouse inclusion? yet here you are saying they would? strange

also, what makes you think the NLs would be the recipient of another £1m or that they deserve it? the NLs are already taking £100k a year (every year) each more than before whilst contributing very little more to the game, yet you are complaining that a completely seperate £330k is being devoted to expanding the game,

ridiculous

Must be the drugs

See above post

I Could not care less about getting ' promoted ' to SL , therefore am not scared of anything that Toulouse do or dont do , I posted that some fans of certain clubs will be upset about it and that might impact upon the finances of those clubs


Previously I have posted that it will also adversly effect the ability of NL clubs to draw financial backing




I am thanks




I am not moaning as you put it , I am giving my opinion , that is that the inclusion of Toulouse will not have any tangible benifit to the other clubs in the NL's , there are only negatives to the clubs in NL 1 ,



I is a long time since I posted anything about what the SL clubs have done , or are you insinuing that the SL clubs have made this decision rather than the RFL ?

it must be, to not see the last two pages where we have quite clearly discuessed the difference between NL1 and NL2,

Please get a room.

:3ta1j1uo

I have put my previous post below [ the one you have just quoted , now no doubt you will try to twist things round but nowhere there can I see that I have posted that the NL's will ' suffer ' ill effects or gain anything

What I have posted is that wether they are successful or not succesful many fans will see it as a failure

So who is [i:3ta1j1uostrange[/i:3ta1j1uo , you seem to be seeing things



And as you are always telling us that RL is not a sport but a business , it is money that really counts isn't it

We have one , it's on here

There's only half a dozen look on here , so you could say this is a private ' discussion '

so then you have nothing to moan about then do you?



but you have also said [iToulouse will not be a ' cancer ' in NL 1 , I have never stated that[/i yet here you are stating that clubs in NL1 will lose income because of Toulouses inclusion,

surely the effects of that would be seen worse in NL2 where there is less money and smaller clubs, and by asking them to take on this burden instead of NL1 clubs, you are showing your true colours a little clearer,




well thats confusing considering you have also said [iThe other 7 clubs will be unaffected[/i (the other three clubs being the ones which want SL but wont get it because of Toulouse but by your own admission, at least one of these three is being protected from themselves by keeping them out of SL,)

so wouldnt that mean only two clubs in NL1, could possibly see a negative effect because of Toulouses inclusion, and even then it wouldnt be a negative that effected them in NL1, simply not being promoted to SL

you seem to contradict yourself at every turn







added to


but then argue that a club of Leigh size, which is similar to Halifax, would be killed if they ever were to be admitted to SL, thats two of those three clubs protected from themselves by Toulouse being promoted ahead of them,

so all this negativity from you on Toulouses inclusion is based on the fact that in 3 years time, Widnes may or may not be promoted to SL and Toulouse may or may not be promoted ahead of them, or with them,



i think all stakeholders will have had an input

...

Your most insightful post ever

An awful lot of editing of complete quotes there

Have you given up on the

NL 1 clubs are very different to NL 2 clubs now

I notice that you missed the bit about nobody coming up with one tangible benifit , which was after all the point of the original post