this season we had 6 overseas, with cusack retiring that would have taken us down to 5, so with berrigan spot freed up that puts us back on 6, so we havn't added to our number

this overseas malarky has turned into a joke, the scrapping of relegation was all about helping bring youngsters through the system, some teams still want to ignore that or just bring the odd player through for an odd game now and then.

Isn't that exactly what ' we ' said ?

The overseas thing will get better pretty quickly. As I understand it the "Overseas Trained" quota has been steadily reduced from 10 in 2008 to 6 this year and 5 for next season. However at the moment, if what I've been told is true, the majority if not all the overseas players that were under contract in SL when the new rules (Club Trained/UK Trained/Overseas Trained) were introduced in 2008 were exempt from the Overseas Trained quota. Which explains why, for example, Leeds can have 7 overseas players when the quota is only 6 for this year. But as these players slowly retire/go back to the NRL this will be reduced down to the actual level of the quota.

If any of that makes sense.

probably, but i aint trawling through 16 pages

unless certain clubs still go crawling and begging to the rfl for more special dispensation

then it becomes the fault of the RFL. Clubs will do what's best for clubs, its the RFL's job to do what's best for the game (although i still don't see how replacing players with poorer quality players due to the poor development systems at school level will improve the SL standard?)

Ok, so then they kick hull kr out of SL do you then start moaning that it is RFLs fault in some other way for not forcing Hull KR to be run in a sustainable way?

it woud be much better for everyone involved, including hull kr if they didnt make the choice to employ Australian reserve grade players

You seem to have a strange understanding of the word "sustainable".

What did you think of Rovers signing Dobson?

not really
i think he is a decent enough player, i dont think he is among the best in the country, others disagree but i dont. I think he gets the plaudits he does because he is the only real pivot Hull KR have, the better teams have 3 or 4, sometimes 5 in a match day squad, everything at Hull KR goes through him.

Look at the fantastic job Huddersfield have done, built from nothing a few years ago, now 80 mins from the GF with young many young english players,from their academy, from the fringes of other sides, and from the lower leagues.

Dream team 2 years running is not bad for a "fringe" player from Aus don't you think?



Huddersfield are doing well, they've had quite some time in SL to get to this point though haven't they? Quite a bit longer than Hull KR at least.

not bad but could be better.

whilst they have, it has taken them the entire time they have been in SL to put this in place. They also didnt have the benefit of an SL franchise.

Besides their 5th year back in SL was 2007, they went in to that season with only 6 overseas players, rather than the ten you are needing. They finished 5th

Unlikely, I'm a non-smoker.

Every player could be better. The point is that according to your exacting standards he should never have been signed, when in fact he has proven to be capable of consistent high standards and is clearly the kind of high quality player we want to see in SL. By your own admission there are players outside SL that are capable of stepping up, does this not mean that there are fringe players in the NRL that could also be excellent players if given an opportunity (in the NRL or SL), as with Dobson?



Didn't they receive a parachute payment of hundreds of thousands of pounds when relegated specifically to maintain youth development? That would mean an uninterupted financial resource and ability to develop young players from the inception of SL, which makes your 5 year comparison (apart from all the other reasons why it's nonsense) dubious.

Completely wrong. If Dobson were to go back to Aus now he still wouldnt be a first grade halfback. With his age he would likely have been cast off.

The fact we cant produce 12 halfbacks better than him is evidence of how poor our development is. One of the reasons it is poor is because at 18/19/20 players arent getting necessary game time they need because they at that stage, with 0 experience arent better than a 24 year old Michael Dobson who has 4 years SL experience.
Not at all. It is since being back in SL that Hudds have brought through Lawrence, Cudjoe, Mcgilveray, These players werent affiliated to Hudds when they were in the NLs, They have been brought in since. Since promotion they have gone out and signed Lunt, Kirmond, Raleigh and Patrick from outside SL. The have picked up young players like Carlile and Mcnally

Why can Huddersfield find 3 british halfbacks but Hull KR cant find one? Brough and Robinson are clearly good enough for an SL side, Mcnally is clearly good enough to be given a shot, he is now 19 perfect age to be stepping up to first grade level yet Hull KR need to go out and sign a reserve grade halfback like Blake Green to go with a reserve grade halfback like Michael Dobson.

If your youth development isnt good enough yet why not give a shot to 21 year old Kyle Wood, he is moving to Cas at the end of this year from Hudds? or 18 year old Cain Southernwood who got massive raps at the Wildcats and is an England Academy international, he has moved to the Bulls?
Isnt Tansey rumoured to be available? Can do a decent job at halfback, he is young, british, and played 21 games in leeds 2007 title winning season. 18 in their 2008 SL winning season.
Matty Smith is moving to salford at the end of the year, again, why not get him in. Clearly good enough to play for Hull KR
Richie Myler moved at the end of last year why didnt you get him?

You could look at the lower leagues, give a shot to Thackray or Allan?

If you do need more time to get your youth development in order (and i think 5 years is enough to be honest, many many many players are regulars as teenagers) then in the meantime go british, it worked out with Watts, you have shown its not that difficult why not do it again?

because you can't fill a team with untested 19 year olds. Dobson was playing 1st grade and their fans were very disappointed he left (he has since proven to be one of the best 1/2 backs in SL), Green has played the equivalent of a full season of NRL and played for Asutralian schoolboys (not a bad pedigree!), neither were "reserve grade". We tried a young british half back in fact we had two, one we let go due to a poor attitude, the other turned out not to be good enough in our coaches opinion. I am sure if there had been another 24 year old with Greens pedigree, available for the same salary and a year of SL under his belt available we would have signed them.

In the end I return to my point, as a fan of HKR I dont give a frick what colour passport they have if we are succesful.

Is he? Since when?

He must, Smokey says so!

you had one with the same pedigree as Green. Green clearly is an NRL reserve grade player, he hasnt player a full season of NRL he has played 33 games in 5 years as a professional. He is distinctly average, the definition of a reserve grader.

There are many 24 year olds with much more than the equivalent of a single season of first grade in their careers. Many even younger with more experienced, Tansey, Moore, Myler, Smith, Wood, Tomkins etc

And the 18/19/20 year olds will never get that year of SL under their belt because clubs keep employing dross like Green instead of risking them for that year. You could have gone out and made a big play for a Mcnally, Wood, Southernwood and given them that year of SL, next year rather taking a risk on an unproven NRL reserve player

and no-one is asking you to fill a team with untested 19 year olds. You have one player in your entire squad under 20, and he is a bit-part reserve winger, with 4 appearances to his name. You could more than accomodate a british youngster instead of an NRL reserve grader. Your players arent youngsters, even ones like Welham, Mariano, and Ratu who your fans claimed are being developed are 22/23.

and ill tell you again, that its that kind of self-interest which damages the game, and its a very hollow victory that any relative Hull KR 'Success' is based on the fact that they arent making the same contribution to the british game as other clubs.

thats what i was told. If he doesnt, then theres a player Hull Kingston Australia can give a shot to right there, 21, british halfback, plenty of experience in the lower league and a little of SL. Has 3 other british Halfbacks in front of him. Would be a perfect signing if Hull KR are going down the unproven route

I trust Leeds will not be fielding thier 7 overseas players against Wigan on saturday?

7 strangely the same amount as Hull Kingston Australia fielded against Wigan this past week

Hope your right smokey, young, enthusiastic, didnt look out of place when he was on loan and a cas lad to boot.

It probably depends on whether or not they choose to player their club developed English international winger/fullback/ at Winger or ullback. If Smith plays on the wing, then no, Scott Donald, who i have long said shouldnt have got a contract at Leeds, he also isnt good enough to be taking a place from a young british player, (he also is an SL dream team member twice in two seasons like dobson) wont be playing, He is leaving at the end of this season and isnt likely to replaced by an overseas player as Leeds have 2 club developed English international wingers in Smith and Hall, a young prospect who has been given games in Watkins and another three quarter, developed by leeds in the England Train-on squad in BJB. Not to mention Broughton who is in the train on squad who was developed at Leeds, Calderwood and Fox, also international wingers developed by leeds. Though the principle is correct, Leeds should have been able to develop a winger better than Donald(which to be far, we have done a fair few times) and Prop who can do the job Kylie does Which would bring us down to five, Which imo would be the ideal number for clubs to be aiming for. 5 high quality imports.Because your others where injured. If you are happy to go into the game against wigan with 7, why do you need to add three to that number next year? i wouldnt complain if you were going into next year with 7, it would show you were moving in the right direction.

At the end of the day Smokey with all these average australians Rovers have signed and with the further ones they will be adding coupled with the fact that Leeds have all these superb home grown players you might be able to defeat Hull Kingston Australia at least once in the league next season

What that every player could be better? Whether Dobson would be reserve grade or not in the NRL is irrelevant. He is SL quality and not only that dream team 2 years running means he has clearly added to the quality of the competition.



Do you think that Justin Morgan is so stupid that given choice of comparable half backs, if they were available, he would choose to pay twice/three times as much for one just because he's an Aussie?



They did get a parachute payment specifically for youth development. And who did they sign Raleigh from? If he wasn't given the same ultimatum as Chris Charles (who went to Salford) sign now for guaranteed SL rugby or stay where you are and take your chances, he would probably still be at Hull KR now. If Blake Green turns out like Micahel Dobson then we'll have an excellent half back pairing. This is the same argument you are making about signing from lower leagues, why are there not excellent Aussie players outside of or on the fringes of the NRL?



I think the under 18's prove that our youth development is now good enough, you simply refuse to acknowledge the time required to recruit, develop and bring these players into the SL squad given the specific circumstances faced by Hull KR.



If there are players which will enhance Rovers' squad whether they be British, Aussie, Kiwi or Chinese, SL, NRL, National Leagues or Tiddlywinks players and they are available and want to come to Rovers then I'm sure we'll sign them.

I'm quite surprised by your u-turn on this from the point of arguing prior to SL expansion that there were emphatically NO players outside SL of SL quality. Now you seem to see them everywhere!

thats some straw your clutching at