I like yourself dont have access to the innerworkings of castleford tigers but i wasnt the one claiming it wouldnt be built, with no evidence, was I?

Our accounts are quite healthy for a super league club, its one of the things the rfl praised last time.

But a team called TEAM SKY RL doesn't sound too marketable

....neither does Harlequins Rugby League apparently

IIRC didn't Atkins come from Bradford and George from Huddersfield?

Quins, Salford, Crusaders, Wakey and Castleford are all at risk IMO.

Throw em all out & Bratfut, Replace them with

Widnes
Fev
Fax
Barrow
Toulouse
& Leigh or Sheff

That would shake everyone up & send the right message to all Championship clubs that if you keep on trying to improve we will not close the shop to you all.

SL phat cats have wallowed in the cream for long enough, give the others a chance.

Difference is Hull and Hull KR actually bring alot to the league, the derby is only one of a few games that could regular attract upto 20,000.

Wrong...what it would do is confirm the MEDIA's belief that RL is a northern sport and given that the MEDIA is all London based, limit the advertising opportunity to buy your council house, conscilidate your loan and rent a pigeion type advertisers.....ie, SKY would bu99er off and you can all go back to watching RL in freezing, derelict stadiums with you and your auntie as the only fans........

Sorry mick....you are obviously a very passionate RL fan and believe your club deserve to be at the top table....but if you think SKY/the RFL will make a decision based on tradition then you need to up your meds......and if you believe that the RFL don't ask SKY for their opinion then the meds are not worth taking.

Mind you....you're right about Bradford

So one game a season?

I would not be surprised to see Cas and Wakey stripped off their franchises with one of them given a guarantee from the RFL that the first one of them to come up with a stadium would get back in next time.


Alternatively i could see the RFL teling them to merge now so that they keep a spot between them with both teams keeping a NL1 place for 3 seasons and then given the opportunity to come back as a single entity team if they meet the criteria in 2015.

I did not claim it wouldn't be built. This is what wrote....



I have no 'evidence' (what is it with VT and 'evidence'

) to prove this nor have you evidence to say it will. Stalemate. Hence I wrote...



You cannot because it isn't there.

So on the balance of probability, recent Gvt cutbacks, press releases, statements form your Chairman last week, your lot and Wakey 'will they wont they' love in/fall out, it's fairly clear to anyone on the outside looking in that you're no nearer to starting your own ground than you were a couple of years ago and [size=150currently[/size have [size=150next to zero chance [/sizeof a new ground of their own when the franchise slection comes which is what we're all talking about, and not whether Cas might have a new ground some time in the next millenia.

[size=200It is a Northern sport.[/size

It's not even a belief system - it's a fact. That media tag will NEVER disappear so long as i've got a hole in my ar[is[/ie. It's no good trying to adopt the "Mrs Bouquet" attitude. We will always be Mrs Bucket, however irksome that might be to some people. If BskyB "wake up and smell the coffee" will they withdraw one of their flagship programmes off the telly? Will they fook. Do you think the media give a positive response to what's happened in London over the last twenty years? Do Sky get embarrassed when they broadcast a Harlequins match? What is the media's belief there? I keep hearing what would happen if the game lost it's presence in London and how it would kill our game in an instance. It's fanciful stuff.

So just your opinion then? for one thing we are nearer than we were two years ago hth

And you still havent told me what you think castlefords debt levels are.

The derby is just one example, as you well know.

In your opinion

Oh absolutely, of course. The VT is 95% opinion and 5% fact.

In my opinion

where's the 5% fact

The content of tb's posts. He always deals in facts, despite his signature.

my super league for 2012

WIGAN
SAINTS
WARRINGTON
WIDNES
SALFORD
BARROW
LEEDS
HUDDERSFIELD
HULL KR
HULL FC
BRADFORD
QUINS
CATALANS
CRUSADERS

bye bye to wakey and cas, hello to barrow and widnes. I feel we need to capitalise on cumbria, there is potential up there. Barrow seem the likely club to improve facilities etc so why not give them a chance. Widnes are ready for SL. There academy side is the envy of many super league clubs, same with facilities, they have a good fanbase and a good coach. and a committed board of directors.

100% correct. It is my opinion but you have not given me any 'evidence' to the contrary. Feel free to do so.



You've got an architect to knock up some pictures of what it might look like once you know what field it's going in, but still have not submitted plans for full planning permission, becuase you don't know what field its going in, whilst last week you had Richard Wright talking about a shared stadium being the best way forward, once they decide what field to put it in.

You're no nearer to starting your stadium than I am of building a spaceship launch pad in my back garden. In my opinion, of course.

Feel free to prove me otherwise.

I've not found this out from Larry The Liar in my local pub here in Leigh, it is on your own website and the Pontefract and Castleford Gazette website but feel free to prove me wrong so I can change my opinion.



Apologies, I've been busy.

Your published accounts are only showing up to 31st December 2008 but unless you've won the lottery or can prove otherwise I dont see any potential trend bucking. They show the following;

A Profit and Loss Reserve account of £-1.68 million. This is your accumilated losses to that date. [iMinus [/ione point six eight million pounds. In 2004 it was £-0.9m million. Your working capital is now £-1.7million.

That's a lot of continual loss in 4 years don't you think?

Total assets of £2.6 million (mainly generated from tangiable assets which I assume to be your land). Very good. Liabilities of £1.9m. Not very good. Net assets of £708k which is £300k less than the year before.

So, from your P&L reserve account hostory you're losing around £300k per year and your Balance Sheet is rapidiy eating into the land you own. If the land value is removed (because its currently propping the clubs value up) and Cas have a net worth of around £-1.7million.

Another year or so (and potentially a lower value of the land itself from 2007 when its value was written into the Fixed Assets, to 2010 land prices) and the Balance Sheet won't be very rosy because you can only sell your land once. Once its sold and money put towards redevelopment costs, what props up your balance sheet because you cannot write into it the value of a rented stadium.

For our part, Leigh have liabilities of £1.2m (Cas £1.9m), working capital of £-1.1m (Cas £-1.7m), and net worth of £-1.1m (Cas £0.7m with land and around £-1.7m without).

Both results are very poor and cause for concern but Leigh have a new ground built and are not relying on a land value to prop up their daily trading activites.

We're a long way from being a SL club and I wont pretend otherwise but don't kid yourself to thinking you're miles ahead of us. Like I said, you can only sell your land once, as we found out to our detrement over a decade ago. All it does is plug a short term hole and then the really big problems set in.

No we have a firm of architects drawing up designs for the stadium, something that is needed to gain full planning permision which is the next step. Which is a hell of a lot differant to an architect doing a few pictures of what it might look like.

There is no issue of 'which field it will be in' we know exactly where the stadium is going.

Theres no such thing as the pontefract and castleford gazette.

So we have some debt, like nearly every other rl club, and less of a debt than many rl clubs. Hardly big news or reason to panic (or else mostfans in the country should be panicking). As i understand cas lost 220k last year so obviously things are improving from 300k a year.

Halifax had architects plans, planning permissions, foundations laid, then a stand built, then some seats put in ..................................... and then ran out of money.

Until it's built and then opened by a third rate celebrity it aint worth a hill of beans. That's my take on it anyway. No criteria points should be awarded unless it's complete and you're using it in my opinion. That doesn't mean to say that your whole application should be flushed down the toilet. Like what happened to Leigh two years ago - it simply shouldn't be considered for a criteria point. If there was greater competition for places by applicants then the RFL wouldn't even be considering fancy plans or half built stadia. But there isn't is there? What results is a farce of a system and leaves the RFL open to ridicule and accusations. See what the fall-out is like in March 2011 from disgruntled fans and Chairmen alike.

Quote ="pyeman"No we have a firm of architects drawing up designs for the stadium, something that is needed to gain full planning permision which is the next step. Which is a hell of a lot differant to an architect doing a few pictures of what it might look like. There is no issue of 'which field it will be in' we know exactly where the stadium is going. Theres no such thing as the pontefract and castleford gazette. '" www.pontefractandcastlefordexpre ... 6432213.jp You new exactly what publication I meant. Express. Gazette. Pigeon Fanciers Monthly. Call it what you want. There still isnt a story in there confirming catagorically 100% what field its going to be in, or when it will be built. In fact, it says this.... Quote A feasibility study will be carried out to establish whether the sides should play at Castleford Tigers' proposed development in Glass Houghton or Wakefield Wildcats planned stadium in Stanley.'" I'd be giving them a ring if I were you and telling them to get their act together. Send them your 'evidence', the top secret stuff that you're unwilling to share with us on here. The architects might now be colouring in their pretty pictures because until you know who will develop the stadium you don't know what form of contract it will take. If it's design and build, the preferred and common route for such developments, then why would you waste money on providing full designs for a project that does not even have its full funding sorted out? How do you know what budget to work to, or the capacity? The answer is 'they wouldn't' so your architects will simply be colouring in the pretty pictures they did for outline planning. When the job hits Glenigans or similar with a wallop I'll let you know. Until then it's as far advanced as my space ship station. Quote ="pyeman"So we have some debt, like nearly every other rl club, and less of a debt than many rl clubs. Hardly big news or reason to panic (or else mostfans in the country should be panicking). As i understand cas lost 220k last year so obviously things are improving from 300k a year.'" You have a link for that or is it something else you're keeping a big secret? What other clubs do is irrelevant. You wanted to compare Cas with Leigh and how many miles apart they are. Your liabilities are far greater than ours, like us are heamoraging money every month, and are propping the balance sheet with your land value. Without it, your accounts are horrific. But, if you still think you're miles ahead then fair enough.

Quote ="pyeman"No we have a firm of architects drawing up designs for the stadium, something that is needed to gain full planning permision which is the next step. Which is a hell of a lot differant to an architect doing a few pictures of what it might look like. There is no issue of 'which field it will be in' we know exactly where the stadium is going. Theres no such thing as the pontefract and castleford gazette. '" www.pontefractandcastlefordexpre ... 6432213.jp You new exactly what publication I meant. Express. Gazette. Pigeon Fanciers Monthly. Call it what you want. There still isnt a story in there confirming catagorically 100% what field its going to be in, or when it will be built. In fact, it says this.... Quote A feasibility study will be carried out to establish whether the sides should play at Castleford Tigers' proposed development in Glass Houghton or Wakefield Wildcats planned stadium in Stanley.'" I'd be giving them a ring if I were you and telling them to get their act together. Send them your 'evidence', the top secret stuff that you're unwilling to share with us on here. The architects might now be colouring in their pretty pictures because until you know who will develop the stadium you don't know what form of contract it will take. If it's design and build, the preferred and common route for such developments, then why would you waste money on providing full designs for a project that does not even have its full funding sorted out? How do you know what budget to work to, or the capacity? The answer is 'they wouldn't' so your architects will simply be colouring in the pretty pictures they did for outline planning. When the job hits Glenigans or similar with a wallop I'll let you know. Until then it's as far advanced as my space ship station. Quote ="pyeman"So we have some debt, like nearly every other rl club, and less of a debt than many rl clubs. Hardly big news or reason to panic (or else mostfans in the country should be panicking). As i understand cas lost 220k last year so obviously things are improving from 300k a year.'" You have a link for that or is it something else you're keeping a big secret? What other clubs do is irrelevant. You wanted to compare Cas with Leigh and how many miles apart they are. Your liabilities are far greater than ours, like us are heamoraging money every month, and are propping the balance sheet with your land value. Without it, your accounts are horrific. But, if you still think you're miles ahead then fair enough.

Because quite simply, on and off the pitch Cas are better then Leigh in every possible way, shape and form, it isn't even a fair argument to compare the 2 clubs.

As for the stadium you seem to know so much about

I'd just shut up and give over if I were you because you're making yourself look silly saying they don't even know where the stadium is going to be etc.

That's not strictly true is it? Your club's recent media headlines wouldn't suggest "in EVERY possible way" would they? That said - i do think Castleford are currently better equipped than Leigh to handle Super League.