Can't the players just cover their legs and arms in future? Or am i missing something? Some kind of fitted Lycra? I thought the pitch looked and played great. Feel very very sorry for Mathers though, that grazed knee must be debilitating.

It is a bit like crying over spilt milk tbh. If they were all moaning about damaged / sprained joints then I'd be concerned not a bloody grazed knee!

As seen elsewhere if the games were the other way around and Salford pics came through first I doubt anyone would have been kicking up much fuss about it.

didn't England Academy play AIS on the 3g pitch outside the LSV?

Just got back from the Stobart and NW Crusaders 62-0 win against Halifax Under 23s.

After all the hoohaa after Friday's game about the pitch we expected to see plenty of claret. However, really impressed with the pitch, for one thing allowing the game to be played today at short notice and giving up some cracking tries. Like watching summer rugby! Surprised too that after Friday the players weren't extra protected except for a big dollop of Vaseline. A few grazed knees but worth the run out with another confidence boosting performance from the new Cru.

Some players were wearing base layer tops yesterday.



But was any complaints made about Nick Fozzard with his arm bandaged?

Only if you completely misunderstand the meaning of the expression 'no use crying over spilt milk.'

In the end, it's the Widnes players who will suffer the most and we've already witnessed them making public complaints then quickly retracting them, no doubt after a massive bollocking from Mr O'Connor.

For me, if the plastic pitch continues to cause these types of abrasion injuries in the warmer weather, then it has no future as a playing surface; it will go back to being a training surface and we'll play on grass again, like we have for the past 100 years or so. In that circumstance, I'm sure that the groundsmen from WTW and Cas could offer some advice to those clubs less able to maintain a decent pitch, to ensure that everyone is up to our already high standards.

Which is what I posted earlier, it is Widnes who will potentially suffer the most

Given the RFL's approach to 'news,' I expect they'll do a press release next week suggesting that Widnes players have got the smoothest and most effectively exfoliated skin in SL, demonstrating that the i-pitch is a complete success.

Both those matches were played at the LSV stadium, undersoil heating

You seriously think clubs will knock down modern cantilever roofs and replace them with ' tin shacks ' , or even get rid of roofs completely to improve their pitches ?

This isn't about being able to maintain a decent pitch. The Widnes groundsmen won awards over the years and our grass always looked in good shape.

The Widnes ipitch has had 3 games and a training session on it in 3 days. It doesn't matter how good your groundsmen are, a grass pitch could not withstand that. The ipitch provides a regular income that could prove to be a life saver for many clubs, and help keep them solvent.

There are certainly question marks over it, but I think it is worth giving it a season or so to prove itself before dismissing it of of hand. [i'We've played on grass for 100 years'[/i isn't really an argument, is it?

Starbug, how on earth can you feck up the quote box so often? You've been doing this for years now. What on Earth are you doing?

Posting on my android tablet,

My ar5e.

When you click the quote button leave the contents of the quote alone. Just leave it and start typing below it. Stop fannying around with the brackets and the stuff inside the brackets.

Like this?

All I was doing was leaving the relevant bit in the quote, posting on this thing means you cant ' highlight ' parts you are answering

Maybe so, however they have been training on it for weeks and had 2 (less intense obviously) hit outs against the 20's on it without complaints. Few players in discussions with others said it was the worst it's felt and that Cullen had told Paul Johnson (retired one) that it wasn't all that far off frozen. Though for some reason conditions still not being taken into account by some even though the game the next day proved grass could be much worse effected.



You seem to be missing the main idea of the pitch? Training, extra revenue from other games / etc. I get the feeling your club is one of many keeping a close eye on it as should you get a 'community stadium' that you maybe after a multi use surface would be absolutely ideal.

I think if we are being 100% honest if it turned out the only issues were that at -5 and lower temperatures a few players got knee grazes i'd say the pitch would be a roaring success.

Whether that will be the case when conditions change, we shall see.

No, I'm not missing that at all; but if it proves to be unfit for purpose, then any plans to that effect shouldn't come to fruition.



We shall.

How the criticism of the pitch has continued beyond the picture of Matty Ashurt's knees is unbelievable. Two games played in very similar weather conditions.
Hopefully more will become clear following the home game against Salford in two weeks time which should be played in better conditions. As has been said, this is a season long experiment.

Couldn't help but laugh out loud at the poster that claimed rock hard pitches only happen in the snow though. Terrific that.

Woolston Rovers went to Leigh East on saturday after the referee declared the 3G pitch there playable for the game. Fortunately I was still out injured so didn't have to endure the pain that others suffered



Speaking to one of their coaches they said the fact that there was snow on it that it wouldn't be too bad as the surface would be more moist when hitting the deck, they said it's worse in the summer when its hard and isn't very moist.

All in all though made for a very competitive game of rugby at -4 degrees temperatures and it finished 20-20, most of the players with shredded knees and complaints on Facebook the next day...

Pitch...

Why people are comparing the Widnes and Salford pitches I don't know. One was played on an ipitch, the other was played on a grass pitch covered in snow. There is no reason for a comparison.

On one surface you're rubbing against an artificial surface, on the other you're rubbing against frozen ice particles.

The damage the ipitch caused was clear for all to see on Friday. Almost every player had blood streaming from their knees and elbows - that is not normal, and whatever Widnes fans might say that was the first time I've seen so many injuries of that nature, as a player or spectator. According to the manufacturer the rubber crumb infill of the ipitch can freeze to some degree but they also talk about easy 'frost management' down to temps of -4, so it's hard to argue that the temperature was really a factor.

Playing on snow is something else entirely, even though the injuries may appear similar.

As for the suggestions players can just wear long clothing, don't be ridiculous. Firstly, the situation shouldn't even arise where they have to. Secondly, I can't imagine that would be such a good idea in scorching summer temperatures. Ipitch burns or dehydration/hyperthermia? Your choice.

Finally, several players themselves have vociferously blamed the ipitch - even Widnes players until their comments mysteriously vanished. They are the ones to experience it in a full-blooded SL game and RL players are not a soft bunch prone to complaining (well, perhaps Mathers is an exception).

I understand the commercial benefits of the ipitch, but still don't think it was a good idea. Let's see what a game in more temperate conditions brings.

Exactly. Too early to be dismissing an initiative off the back of one single game.

It's an example that your knees can get fecked in many different situations, not just because you're on a plastic pitch.


If it was clear, people wouldn't have had to post pictures on Twitter. I didn't notice "streaming blood" from players' knees. I saw a few grazes, as you'd expect in any game.


It was a cold night, you've just said it. The crumbs can freeze. I think it would be pretty easy to argue. A lot of the moisture will have frozen, meaning there would have been a harder than normal surface.


I'll agree with that, although the point I think is that you can scrape your knees on other surfaces. It's not a phenomenon known only to a plastic pitch. Will players be posting their grazes in summer?


You clearly don't know what skins actually do then. They aren't there to keep you warm. There are different kinds of skins. Some are designed to cool you down by taking the sweat away from the body so you don't overheat. They actually help prevent muscle injuries in most cases as well.

If the situation arises where we find that playing on an iPitch gives clubs the opportunity to bring in more revenue because the pitch is in better nick, then wearing skins would be a hit I'd happily take.


First of all, the Widnes players that commented on it are absolute morons.
Secondly, it's not like a RL player/coach/fan/etc to jump to an early conclusion, is it!


Do you not think it's a bit contradictory to come to a conclusion after one week and then say we should see what happens?

Yes, different situations. Yet people are using the injuries at Salford to somehow vindicate the ipitch, despite the different conditions and different pitches.


You need a bigger telly then. Admittedly I didn't notice how widespread it was at the time (mainly because I was in the pub) but I did notice some blood. Having watched it back it's clear there's far more claret flowing from knees and elbows than is normal, in summer or winter.


In that case Widnes should make a complaint. Allegedly this ipitch can handle temps down to -4°C with some simple 'frost management'. If that isn't the case they should be looking closely at the claims of the manufacturer.


That's not a relevant point at all. The fact that other surfaces and conditions can cause burns does not vindicate the injuries the ipitch appears to have caused.

I've played the last 3 summer seasons and only once suffered a burn-like graze, and that's on amateur pitches. At SL level the pitches are watered and kept lush and that's not a problem.


I didn't say they are designed to keep you warm. I said it's a nonsense to expect players to wear extra layers in hot weather.

If they can keep you so cool why don't all players already wear them in hot conditions? If it's 32°C outside you're not trying to tell me putting an extra layer will help? I don't care how good some 'skins' claim to be, wearing them in peak summer temperatures is plain daft.

Further, players wear what they are most comfortable in and feel they perform best in. Some find 'skins' restrictive, others prefer them. Why should they be forced to wear unfamiliar gear just to suit one club?

I've used some of these skins, with all their intelligent claims and wonderful technology and have never noticed any difference between them and a normal supportive item.

[size=85(Doesn't the body sweat in order to keep cool? How would wearing a tight layer that removes sweat keep you more cool?)[/size


These 'morons' had just played on the pitch and know a little more about what caused their injuries than you or I. I think I'll take their opinion over yours.


Not really. I said the ipitch should apparently have been able to cope with the temperatures, and that it clearly caused injuries. Whether some of the rubber crumbs had retained moisture and frozen we don't know, so let's see what a warmer game brings.

www.sportinglife.com/rugbyleague ... idnes.html WIDNES CONFIDENT ABOUT PITCH DESPITE CRITICISM Widnes Vikings have full confidence in the safety of their artificial pitch despite criticism from some of the Wakefield's players in the wake of Friday's opening Stobart Super League match. The Stobart Stadium's revolutionary 'iPitch' was one of the major talking points from the first weekend of the new season. Wakefield full-back Richard Mathers called it an "absolute joke" and used his Twitter account to distribute photographs of his grazed arms and legs after the game, which the Wildcats won 32-14. But the Rugby Football League say they have had no official complaint over the synthetic surface and Widnes chief executive Julie Gaskell insisted the injuries were more likely to have been a result of the icy weather. "We had four games on the pitch this weekend and you have to bear in mind the extreme weather," she said. "Certainly on Friday night it went down to minus seven. "The injuries are consistent with those on any surface in those temperatures and we noted there were similar injuries from the game at Salford on Saturday night. "Our players have been training on a similar surface for the last nine months and there have been no issues. I am sure any problems would have shown up. "We have also had five-a-side football and boys and girls tag rugby on the pitch over the last four weeks and again we have had no reported injuries." The RFL say Friday's match commissioner raised no concerns over the pitch in his report. "We are happy for Widnes to continue using the iPitch," said spokesman John Ledger. "The indications are that it posed no more danger to players than on any other surface over the weekend. We believe the extreme weather may have been an issue." Widnes' academy match against Wakefield at the Stobart Stadium on Saturday was abandoned after 65 minutes after Vikings player Thomas Coyle suffered a compound leg fracture, but the RFL say the pitch played no role in the incident. North Wales Crusaders played Halifax Under-23s on the pitch yesterday while Whitehaven held a training session there on Saturday morning.

www.sportinglife.com/rugbyleague ... idnes.html WIDNES CONFIDENT ABOUT PITCH DESPITE CRITICISM Widnes Vikings have full confidence in the safety of their artificial pitch despite criticism from some of the Wakefield's players in the wake of Friday's opening Stobart Super League match. The Stobart Stadium's revolutionary 'iPitch' was one of the major talking points from the first weekend of the new season. Wakefield full-back Richard Mathers called it an "absolute joke" and used his Twitter account to distribute photographs of his grazed arms and legs after the game, which the Wildcats won 32-14. But the Rugby Football League say they have had no official complaint over the synthetic surface and Widnes chief executive Julie Gaskell insisted the injuries were more likely to have been a result of the icy weather. "We had four games on the pitch this weekend and you have to bear in mind the extreme weather," she said. "Certainly on Friday night it went down to minus seven. "The injuries are consistent with those on any surface in those temperatures and we noted there were similar injuries from the game at Salford on Saturday night. "Our players have been training on a similar surface for the last nine months and there have been no issues. I am sure any problems would have shown up. "We have also had five-a-side football and boys and girls tag rugby on the pitch over the last four weeks and again we have had no reported injuries." The RFL say Friday's match commissioner raised no concerns over the pitch in his report. "We are happy for Widnes to continue using the iPitch," said spokesman John Ledger. "The indications are that it posed no more danger to players than on any other surface over the weekend. We believe the extreme weather may have been an issue." Widnes' academy match against Wakefield at the Stobart Stadium on Saturday was abandoned after 65 minutes after Vikings player Thomas Coyle suffered a compound leg fracture, but the RFL say the pitch played no role in the incident. North Wales Crusaders played Halifax Under-23s on the pitch yesterday while Whitehaven held a training session there on Saturday morning.

I think there is clearly an issue with the ipitch in sub-zero temperatures. What the Matty Ashurst pictures show, is it isn't quite as bad as frozen turf.

We'll have to see how it reacts when the weather is better. It may then just be a case, at worst, of needing a bit of Vaseline or bandage, to prevent grazes. Given the benefits the ipitch could bring, that's a small price to pay.

The jury hasn't even seen all the evidence yet, never mind retired to give their verdict. So, condemning it after just one game makes no sense.