Irrelivant their other scores easily outweigh the stadium issue

You either have a stadium , or you dont , at a given point in time

It's not ' pedantry ' , its called trying and failing to be clever

There are two schools of thought on that.

There is a constituency of opinion that holds that Franchising follows the laws of quantum mechanics. And indeed, they have in their favour the facts that both are hard to fathom and both frequently seem highly illogical but nevertheless true.

This means of course that Heisenberg's Uncertainty Principle applies - you cannot both observe the existence of a stadium project and at the same time determine the progress it has made.

It also explains the role of Schrodinger's Cat in all this, since by extension it is possible for a Stadium Project to be both alive and dead at the same time.

It was all much easier when you could explain who was in what division by simple Newtonian Physics - e.g. for every action (coming top of a league and getting promoted) there was an equal and opposite reaction (relegation).

The other school of opinion of course holds that its all bollox and Divine Intervention (I hesitate to refer to it as "Intelligent Design" for obvious reasons...) holds sway - given the RFL will do what it wants anyway. I tend more to that school of thought personally...

bad luck.

3 years out of SL made widnes stronger as the club did what it takes to get back in

this is about survival of the fittest.

wakey deserve to be punted as far as possible away from SL.

they managed to work out a new deal for the stadium with Halton council , one more suitable to their position as a NL/Championship club

2 Steve O Connor

franchising gave the club time to get things right and then push for SL

look what happened to widnes under P&R, they overspent trying to get promoted, failed and almost went broke

being out of SL made the club desperate to get in so theyve gone about ticking all the boxes required

rather than wasting money on winning the championship they spend it on their juniors

maybe having steve oconner before under p&r woudlve helped

but the whole idea of having their SL status taken away and only granted back if they improve as a club sure worked for widnes.

wakey have shown theyve hit a brick wall. they cant improve any further and their current situation isnt good enough for SL

so they get kicked out. either they do what widnes did and start improving as a club and get back in or they stay out of SL.

clubs are now competing for off field development as well as on field play, and this will make the english game stronger.

all the RFL is trying to do is get clubs to develop themselves. if they cant and there are better options well you replace the weak with the strong.

i personally think the current situation is what the RFL wants

by telling SL clubs one of them will be relegated it forces them to do their best to improve as RL clubs.

if these clubs dont face relegation theyll just stagnate.

the competition between wakey, cas and salford for relegation will make the game better.

:2a9rm1fp

It gave them time ? , no it didn't , they should have got in the 1 st time , all they have done is tead water for what will be 3 years

:2a9rm1fp

Their Stadium deal was crippling them , that is where much of the debt came from , they also had a complete muppet in charge


:2a9rm1fp

A strict salary cap has helped , but the RFL knew how ridiculous the decision to exclude them last time was , they have been very ' cosy with Steve O,Connor ever since [ not a criticism , as for the juniors , Widnes have always had good junior development well before the advent of licencing


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How has it worked ? you dont need to be a rocket surgeon to realise that Widnes are 1 the best equiped club outside SL , and 2 better equiped than 4/5 currently in SL


:2a9rm1fp

Wakey are no different to Cas or Salford in that respect , and lets not even look at Quins or Crusaders

:2a9rm1fp

Do what that Widnes did , get the council to build them a stadium ? , find a local businessman who has just sold his business for 30 million ? , but will a club be allowed back in ever ?


:2a9rm1fp

Not neccessarily , it could quite easily stifle the clubs outside as they are unable to keep fans interested , and with no clear certain path to SL it will become almost impossible for those clubs to get an investor like a Steve O connor , meanwhile the gap between SL and the Championships gets wider and the clubs in SL become complacent as they dont have to improve to stay in , the RFL are doing all they can to deflect blame from themselves about having to decide a club to drop , they wont do it again


and they havent a clue what to do to develop the heartland clubs outside SL other than encourage them to find a Sugar Daddy , which is virtually impossible

Licencing is a shambles , it doesn't work in British sport

Yes that is exactly what will happen , the clubs in SL will stagnate , the clubs outside will struggle to survive and will decline

Oh goody

Salford will be in super league in 2012.
Mark my words.
End of story.

ive said wakey are the ones going down

starbug cant really be bothered but you are dead wrong.

franchising is P&R based over a 3 years cycle with entry to SL based on the strongest club outside it and relegation based on the weakest heartland club

clubs like wakey and cas have had decades to get it right

now the RFL is putting a guns to their head and saying sort it out or get out of SL.

the lesser SL clubs just cant sort themselves out so franchising was needed to do it

if franchising wasnt around barrow wouldve gotten into SL and widnes missed out

how can this be a good thing for the future of the english game?

every three years , I seriously doubt they will do that

'Weakest heartland club ' , so you admit it is all about expansion , as you know ,I know , the whole RL world knows that there are clubs outside the heartlands that are weaker than every one in the heartlands

Quins have had decades to get it right

So a club in an area 100 miles away from any other SL club with a benefactor willing to put money into that club would have been bad for the British game ?

You ignored this one , so I'll give you another go




Away you go

its not just about expansion, but yes, protecting expansion clubs from relegation is important.

its also about getting clubs like cas, wakey and salford new grounds

its about clubs improving their marketing and crowds

clubs investing in juniors

most english clubs have failed so the RFL is basically forcing them, and the ones that cant lose their SL spots

it also means that if championship clubs want to get into SL they have do more than just win the grand final. they also have to think about juniors, marketing etc.

franchising gives clubs 3 years to prove they are worth a spot or they get booted out.

why wouldnt the RFL keep changing teams every 3 years? thats what keeps clubs honest.

barrow in their current state are not fit for SL.

their ground is a dump.
their finances are poor.

indeed i seriously doubt they ever will be fit for SL.

barrow in SL is taking the game backwards.

once widnes had satisfied the criteria re winning the champ. / NR cup they didnt need to waste any more money on players which is essentially wasted

having ticked that box they concentrated on the other areas of their franchise like the juniors and their crowds.

Because the RFL are not ' honest ' , do you seriously think they want all this crap every three years , having to choose a club to drop out , how exactly do you ' prove ' your worth ?

you prove your worth by looking at the franchise criteria and trying to maximise all areas of your application.

why are wakey after 15 years of making false promises trying their best for a new ground? cause they know they are gone without it.

SL should be for the elite clubs, clubs who are strong and contribute to the strength of the game. it should be because a club got lucky on grand final day

So having good 1 st team is wasting money , better tell Melbourne and W1g4n



Their juniors were already in place well before franchising , those kids will have been with Widnes 6/7 years by now

Their crowds have gone down

Away you go try again

They let Celtic in with a dump , Cas twice ,

Finances better than Wakey ,Quins and Celtic