In all seriousness, whilst I agree that not letting non ST holders into a fans forum is a little OTT with the "Season Ticket Holder Perks", I also think it's a little OTT for non ST holders to get annoyed or feel slighted by the club for not being able to get in.

It really makes little difference either way and isn't a big deal in the slightest. But as usual, why let an event's insignificance get in the way of pretending to be offended by it.

is that it cuts the bar takings....but, speaking as a season ticket payer, I agree with Pumpety and don't think the club should differentiate in this way. It's just plain wrong, however it's dressed up and it sends the wrong message to what is a large section of the fans.

You say "annoyed", I (as the person writing most of it) would say "bemused and mildly irked". I've described the many ways you can reward STs and simply posed the question of why a fans forum needs to be one of them.



Well that's a nice attempt at a thread killer isn't it. "Opposing points are automatically invalid" kind of hinders debate.

How are they going to police this when the 2014 STs haven't even been distributed yet?
Are they really going to scan a list of names on the door? Could take a while to get everyone seated if that's the case.

I'm not going, does anyone want to pretend to be me for the evening

Not at all. I agree with you in that it's a daft thing to penalise non-ST holders in this way (and you're right in other ways you reward ST holders, rather than this). And it wasn't you I was referring to there anyway, as you've said before, you're mildly annoyed by it, but don't seem to have gone overboard. It's the ones who go ridiculously over the top and make out they're being outcast by the club that I'm referring to. Crazy overreactions to a minor thing that makes very little difference.

By all means discuss it, but I'm suggesting those getting all uppity about it are taking things a bit far.

According to the T&A that is [iexactly[/i the plan.

Isn't it really the same call as Ryanair made recently - about there being no point in unnecessarily ing people off?

Definitely. It seems a slightly pointless exercise, especially as has been mentioned, because the forums are not "packed to the rafters" anyway these days. And you'd think the bar takings would be part of why they do these in the first place.

It seems very much to me that someone at the club has tried to emphasise that they should always try and make season ticket holders feel special, and then whoever has organised the forum has taken that ethos a little further than they needed to.

They probably didn't think it would p*ss people off though in fairness, and it shouldn't really. But it inevitably will, so it's difficult to understand why they're being as strict as checking on the door.

I am not a season ticket holder, but am a sponsor, does this mean i can't go ?

I handed over more than a grand last year in one form or another to the club, and would have liked to have gone to see what they had to say and maybe responded to it.

Not such a good call

Why don't you contact the club and ask them?

I'd expect a sponsor would be able to make an appointment and have a one to one with the chairman at a mutually convenient time, to be honest - but I agree with your point.

Well that’s not fair now is it. You’ve gone and written a measured response to my bad tempered post. What am I supposed to do now?

Conspiracy theory time! Just make sure you throw in some imagined amounts of money, something about our Directors being sh*t and us getting relegated to Championship 1 (or even the Pennine League if you really want to push the boat out) and you'll be fine

Sponsors get what their sponsorship package says they get. this is for season ticket holders not sponsors so if you want to go, just stump up for a season ticket and job done.

the only gaffe (a big one, and the latest in a long line) is announcing it as a Fans' Forum". Everybody is used to what those are and being able to attend and I have no clue why they stuck with that description. On the club site it states:



that all makes perfect sense. And if they had marketed it as a Season Ticket Holders' Meet-the-Board Night" (which is what it is) or some such, instead of a "fans forum" (which is what it's not) then none of this flak would have fired off.

A reasonable idea in principle, but just handled remarkably badly.

That's really just a question of semantics though, isn't it? I mean, are you really saying that season ticket holders don't count as fans? And it's not like the club has announced a fans forum but kept it a secret that only season ticker holders can go until people turn up at the door. The club has been straight forward in their marketing of the event and are clearly using it as another attempt to drum up some extra season ticket sales

How is it? The Bulls organise all sorts of events. An event to reward season ticket holders by having the chance to personally meet and ask questions of the new board is just one more type of event.


Of course not! Just that the event is for 2014 paid-up season ticket holders specifically, and is expressly part of the additional benefits which you are entitled to if you pay for a season ticket.


I doubt that very much. If any more than a handful of people "buy" admission directly just so they can attend then I would be amazed. They would be a million times more likely to still not buy a season ticket, but instead whinge on here about it not being fair they can't attend a season ticket holders' event, even though they aren't season ticket holders.

I'm not quite sure whether there's a pejorative note in your remark "attempt to drum up some extra season ticket sales". "Drum up"? Unfortunate wording. Is it a bad thing for a business to "drum up" sales, if it does?

,
I suppose that the Directors now are in the position to outline plans for the coming season? And like a normal members club you present these details, as a matter of good sense and courtesy, to your members, who in this case, are being established as season ticket holders! I expect that sponsors will be invited to their own particular meetings. It will then follow that they will have open days and Forums for all supporters in the coming season.
Sounds like a plan to improve the "Meet the Supporters" in a better structured way for 2014?

Is this one of those events that Mr Moore meant when he said he wanted the Coral Suite used more? Good stuff

So this loyal fan who makes 10+ games a year buys a shirt every year and other merchandise isn't important or loyal OK fair do's.

I can see what the club are trying to achieve in adding incentives for people to buy a season ticket. Perhaps the club should simply of allowed free entry to ST holders and charged for non ST holders. So those who don't purchase a ST (for whatever reason) still have an opportunity to put their opinion over to the board. And the club achieve their objective of adding value and encouraging the purchase of a season ticket.

I think it's fair enough to invite season ticket holders only because there really has been no tangible benefit to being a season ticket holder in recent years. What did you actually get for being a season ticket holder? Fiver off a shirt. Entrance to all home games. Anything else special? The board are trying to give season ticket holders a higher status and are right to do so in my opinion. In fact I'd go further and give people who have been season ticket holders for 10 years access to the Coral Stand for free for the poorer games.

I didn't get a season ticket last year (so I'm knackered if they use my idea!) because of the turmoil but also because there was no financial benefit (paid on gate for first half of season and got the half season ticket) and there was no advantage to being a season ticket holder anyway.

I don't think its a case of not being loyal. There have been many loyal fans over recent years and I would imagine that you have been one of many.

I think the difference is that you have chosen to invest in the club at a time which is convenient to you (i.e. you can make a game etc) whereas other have invested in the club in advance. This is absolutely your choice and your prerogative to do so and I don't think anyone would argue that this is not the actions of a disloyal fan.

However it is also the prerogative of the club and their new owners to incentivise people to invest in the club earlier via ST's and I see this exclusive forum being one of them. Added value is something that is used widely in business and running the club as a business is an absolute necessity if we are to survive.

I would also imagine that the owners are trying to do everything in their power to sell as many ST's at a time where no other income is forthcoming.

This has obviously upset some on here, but likewise many now feel that their decision to invest has been recognised and appreciated via this offering. I think it has been said earlier but the club will chose to reward those they feel most valuable to the club (and the business) at the time. Later in the season i imagine that focus will switch to non-season ticket holders in the form of discounted tickets and selected game packages.

As and when that happens I wonder how many non-ST holders will complain of bias then?

Isn't the main reward of getting a season ticket the reduced cost per game against paying per game.

I'd say that was the main reward but i think that more than ever added value needs to be provided. I think this is a contributing factor to why more season tickets (or memberships as I've heard them frequently referred as) haven't been sold.

I do think this is a membership /business tactic, something I have knowledge of (those who know me will be aware that I operate and manage large sports and leisure facilities so I understand the market of adding value to membership based operations very well). Not to everyones taste I appreciate but from a business sense one which does make sense.

I'm grateful to be appreciated in this way but I can understand yours and others frustrations also.

Having been to the majority of these forums before I don't think you'll miss anything (although I get that isn't your point) but i'd be happy to relay anything on here during the forum itself, if this would at all help?

I'd also like to point out that I think its a great step not having pre-arranged questions as this has in the past allowed the management to by-pass some tricky subjects.

I haven't decided if I'll go yet - being a season ticket holder I can have that choice you see, let them eat cake, whatwhatwhat - but I do hope they pass a mic around this time, the last few have just ended up as a shouting match between those in the first few rows. Not to mention "the regulars" on the front row who seem to think the forum is a chance for them to have a nice one-on-one chat for an hour with the top table about how much of a devoted superfan they are.