Dogma should not be used in the practical world. It's maybe something to aim for in the wider sense but you don't get anywhere by only having one plan of attack.

In our best squads, there were 1 or 2 class homegrown players.
3 or four average SL players and then squad fillers.

The rest were a mix of very good SL players and ex-NRL players.

I think there is something of an overblown expectation of the academy. They have churned out 4 or 5 halfbacks in the last 5 years. Yet people are wanting more.

In the last 20 years we have produced 2 world class hookers, 1 world class prop and 1 world class halfback.

Then a range below that.

I'd say our current team is doing well from the academy, but expectations that the academy produce top standards in every position, plus have more in reserve is too high.

Agreed entirely, but that doesn't stop actions being twisted to suit arguments.

Anyway, even if the Burns rumour is true, I doubt it's what St.P was referring to, according to the hull Kr board we put in a formal offer today, St.P was implying the deals close to being done (so in an ideal world both are true and separate rumours

)

I can't see the Burns one being true.

It's not entirely impossible.

There is a huge chunk of money coming off the cap this year. Laffranchi, Sia, would be potentailly big earners and with so much academy in the squad they must be getting maximum dispensations.

Not to mention Wheeler, Gardner, Clough, McDonnell, who will probably cover increases to youth contracts.

McDonnell and the contract extensions we have handed out over the course of the year probably removes Gardner and Clough from consideration. But, Manu could also be added to the list as there's been no word on him.

My guesstimating/ listening to rumours about how much players are on (never reliable!) reckons we have somewhere between 25% to 33% of the cap to play with this year, which coupled with the kids coming through makes us very flexible this year

McDonnell is only to the end of thhis year isn't he??

I've just searched travis burns' name on twitter and nothing much comes up in relation to us. Considering how much of hull's business is conducting on there it seems odd that there's only two mentions of him coming to saints.

I know both players want to come and both happy with the terms they would be getting. Both was given permission to talk to other clubs

I like that we tend to do our business on the quiet. We beat everyone to Amor and got Walsh too. Theres no reason we wont get a couple of good signings for next year

One of them is nearly in the bag but the is another club fighting us for the other. I'll be happy with any of them but be over the moon if we get both.

If we get both, it will be interesting to see if a player will leave to make way for the two.

If it's the two I think it is, I think someone would have to leave. I don't see how it would fit into the squad.

Are they both UK based this season? Both eligible for England?

Maybe one will play 13 with Wilkin reverting to a out and out secondrow with Sia going and looks like Manu going also.

Westerman & Ferres

Would be over the moon with one, let alone both. There were rumours of Westerman to Hull Kr (don't know why hull would let him go after his best season ever) and Ferres is one of the best british second rowers, so I don't understand why Huddersfield would let him go, unless transfer fees are involved for both?

Doesn't solve the 6 problem either unless were willing to stick with lance again and bring in some cover/ decide charnock or Hewitt is ready next year?

That's the only way I can see it working. If McManus pulls it off I'd say it makes us favourites for the league if we can keep everyone fit.

It also suggests that someone will be leaving.

True, I know who I would rather it was!

I'm not sure we on same wave length here

I think it's similar but perhaps not exact

Tommy Leuluai has signed a new three year deal at the NZ Warriors, so I think that puts the Matty Smith to Saints rumour to bed for a while.

Surely we aren't planning on starting a season with a real stand off AND a real scrum half?? This is too good to be true!!!

A while maybe

Is this really obvious? Completely going over my head

As long as it's not Sammutt or Lee I'm happy!

I haven't got a clue either. But it's nice to have a good quality rumour to speculate about.