It's not rocket science, Wigan have a better coach and better coaching methods than everyone else.

Wow - that's 2 now who have seen the light.

Thought Johnny Lomax caused us loads of problems today, fortunately our defence was up to most of it, other than that i think we coped with most of what you threw at us , although saying that Joel Tomkins pass to Carmont kept you in the game when if he had fallen over it would have been 22-2 with a kick to come... you then took your chances and almost gave me a heart attack

There are none so blind as those that will not see.

I can see right through you.

AGREED, IT WILL BE INTERESTING TO SEE HOW THEY ARE NEXT YEAR. PERSONALLY I THINK THEY WILL NOT BE AS GOOD ONCE MAGUIRE GOES.

You hope

I HOPE THEY COMPLETLY FALL TO PIECES AND FINISH BOTTOM HOWEVER I ACTUALLY SAID I DONT THINK THEY WILL BE AS GOOD

Of course he hopes. But whoever takes over at Wigan has to change things in order to justify their existance. That change could easily mean a drop off.

You've also got to factor in Sam's move to Union. That will unsettle things.

Wigan will not be as good, Hoffman is leaving, and Hock will be a regular...



Nevermind their coach leaving and being replaced by his laughing sidekick.

QUALITY

Don't worry about that. We'll just move Matty Russell in. If you think Sam can move and step then watch this kid.

He'll go too. I saw both of them on the rec with Kyle Eastmond the other week practising kick offs, goal kicks and standing still.

This thread is full of utter $h!te spouted by saints fans that have no knowledge of rugby league.

Yes wellens is slow and his attack isn't brilliant. However, he has never been picked based on his attack. He pulled off an amazing tackle on a player that is 3 times faster than him. No one else in our team would do a better job at full back.

Makinson did nothing wrong. He is the most inexperienced player in the team and is already better than Gardner.

Shenton can't do much if he doesn't get the ball.

Meli was superb minus one bad pass. Constantly looked a threat. Joel Tomkins is a very good defender and looked after Meli well but Meli was the main reason we scored any points. Anyone saying he is not a centre, go back and watch fosters first try - unbelievable centre play.

Foster certainly isn't the fastest or best winger ever but he finishes tries and kicks goals. He's better than 80% of wingers in the league.

We lost for 3 reasons only:

1. Wigan finished their chances. They were very clinical.
2. Too many poor last tackle kicks in good positions. Pryce and lomax didn't have the best of games. B
3. We had 4/5 lapses in concentration, Wigan scored 3 tries. Wigan had no lapses in concentration.

Foster is rubbish, if he didn't kick, I doubt he would be a SL player.

Oh and Wellens is hopeless, if I was coach, Saints would be a better team and Eastmond would be in at fullback, him coming into the line at speed with his passing ability would give your team another dimension.

I think this sums up the match perfectly.

I disagree with you on Meli though. His lazy defence, so notable in all our big games, cost us twice. And he also makes dumb decisions about when to pass to Foster. I do hope Wheeler manages to regain his fitness. I'd have him back at centre in a flash because he is dangerous in attack AND committed to defence.

Esstmond was injured.

At times he puts in shocking passes but he has put tries on a plate for foster all season. Beeline was a lazy defender but is a saints hero. Tricky decision when wheeler comes back though who I think will still become our 1st choice number 6 at some point.

Have to disagree. Admittedly wellens is a fantastic fullback and I have the upmost respect for him. However the role of fullback is changing and they are more like a third halfback now. Billy slater and Sam Tompkins are just 2 examples. Ratboy was superb in Attack and defennce as is slater. Wellens is lacking in attack but does support well.
I think lomax would adapt ala Tompkins to fullback and give us that extra dimension. With regards to wellens he could take the spot on the bench because I think he still has lots to offer the team but lomax or maybe makinson or Ashe should be given the chance to prove they are the future and wellens is the ideal mentor.

I agree that they should get a chance. There's a time and a place for that though and a cc semi final against Wigan one of those times.

Wello has to be relieved of his position from the word go next season. Has to.

I agree but once again (for various reasons) we have lost a big game to a major rival. We need to identify our weaknesses and improve on them. Why not try lomax at fullback Gaskell/ pryce in the halves between now and the playoffs. Another plus is that gives wello a break to refresh ( I think he needs and deserves one) and get rid of any niggling injuries.

Got to agree with you Chairmeister; no real issues with the backs (well perhaps wello might be close to the end of his brilliant career.
The issue today was summed up by Simmons - we kept going out wide to our left instead of being a bit more direct or even going to the right occasionally. We were so predictable in that respect.
I'd be well peed off if I was shenton and makinson (who I thought were both v good defensively) but who never saw the ball..

Add to that Meli's missed tackle on their winger and then us letting bambi get over the line with 3 (or was it 4) players sort of half-grabbing him - shame on you LMS, Flanno and Wello, and its no wonder we lost.

However, back from the match I've just watched the recording and for a lot of the time we were much the better team but we didn't use our brains very much.
It is now apparent how unfit Leon still is which is perhaps only to be expected.
It was noticable however that because we decided to pivot ALL our attacking moves through Leon, his lack of positional play in only going down the left channel meant that ALL our play also only went down our left channel.
The Leon of old used to attack through both sides of the ruck area and sometimes down the centre of the ruck area like all good stand offs do.