I havent said that.
Ski made the point that the players have something to prove to the Saints fans.
I dont beleive they do,of course I desperatly wanted to win the Grand Final that goes without saying. Despite loseing the final Im more than happy with the skill, effort and comitment that my team have shown over the last x number of years.
Could they have done better, yea two games better.
As i said if anyone has anything to prove,Its the Saints fans who have become less vocal(passionate?) as the more trophys we have won.
All just my opinion of course.

I was going to reply to Blobby's post, but I'll make the point here that I don't think it's just Saints fans who have become less vociferous. The atmosphere at some SL matches last year were like a family funeral at times.

I was responding to your post where you suggested that your seasons hadn't been a failure. It's a fair point that it is perhaps harsh to call the seasons a failure, however from this team's point of view I genuinely believe they have to step up and prove to the Saints fans how good they are. The Aussies were awesome all the way through the WC, but they lost the final, that is a failure.

In terms of the Saints fans issue, then yes I would agree, many fans I speak to have become a bit disillusioned with the team, and I think a lot of this has been due to the style you have adopted. I think this is why the Saints v Wire games always create so much excitement. Wire play an exciting style, which then seems to draw Saints into their old creative style and it causes some classics (unfortunately always with the same ending!!!).

Cool is it that time of year to dust this thread off again?

I'm sure I saw it in 2007 and 2008.

Yeah? So we win about 8 games all year and you'll be happy with that? I wont be happy going to work on a Monday having pie and dire fans laughing because we lost again! But as long as we make the top 8 eh?

When i go to Saints i expect them to win every match and funnily enough that means they'll finish higher up the league.

As for this so called argument that distresses you so much, no ones mentioned the fact that the league leders should be champions!

God you are boring!

nobody looks back an says "Oh, Leeds lost to Dire at the HJ in August in 2008", they say "Leeds were champions in 2008".

A champion side, the best side in the competition, don't just look good when beating Harlequins by 60 points, they look good against the teams around them in the league and in Grand Finals and pressure matches.

I'm a Rhino. thought i'd clear that up first.

Reading this thread had me laughing my a** off. As already quoted by, I presume, a Saints fan, we won the GF which means we are champions, again. I went to 2007, and 2008 and we mullered you, Saints imo bottled both games, although this year was a lot better as a contest. Everyone that follws this game of ours can testify that finishing top does NOT make you champions, it has been like this for ages, you have to all get over it and concede we are champions. Just like we did when the Bull sh(*s beat us, it's hard but you will be happier..

As for nest season, i would bet my house (as the bald one would say) on it being another Leeds V Saints GF. We (both of us) havent recruited all that well or heavily, compared to perenial teams like Wire (they will not even be in the 8 next year!), Wigan (Ha!) or the Bulls. But that is our secret. Established teams with an outstanding Academy set up.

As for the post above, he talks the most sense. You could argue you play the better rl, but we play to win and not to entertain!! Which would you rather have?????

Anyway, bring on 2009. Champions for three years running??????

Paul

The username gives that away, though the misspelling had me laughing

.

We didn't bottle anything, on the night Leeds played far better than we did. People seem to forget that you had the beating of us in pretty much every encounter in 2007 and were very closely matched in 2008.

Youve turned me into a Norvern Drone!

Were not on about champions were on about topping the league, not what it does or doesnt lead too!

Would you sooner win 5 games a season or 25?

Good point about the spelling, i'd had a few and i cant correct it now!!!

You bottled it, end of. We were/are closely matched but you hammered us in the elimination game, and it the CC semi. I dont think we played better, although the conditions suited Leeds more than Saints. I said in the pub outside the ground that we would win, the conditions helped us more than you. Dont get me wrong, we can play as sexy rugby as you but we adapt better in foul conditions.

I think that your squad probably needs a big overhaul. I'm gonna get grief for this but i truly believe Wellens is past it. KC hasnt got much left, same for Long. Pryce, well what can i say, goes missing in big games is probably the kindest thing, he made Danny look awesome in the GF. Wilkin wasnt good, you missed Maurie and i'm suprised you let Fozzy go.

Our squad isnt perfect but we have much more in depth and players at the right end of their career.

Paul

Oh well. If you say so. Best inform everyone at the club, at Sky and at the RFL.

For me personally, last season offered something to look forward to as opposed to this season. Im not sure why, but i just dont feel as excited about this season as maybe i should do.

Maybe it is something to do with the way we completely folded in the final against Leeds, and the way England didnt show up at the World Cup, has put a dampner on things, who knows.

Do we have something to prove? ? ? Too right we do. I feel it is going to be a much more difficult task too. We still have a good squad, but we lack depth in the squad, with Puletua the only signing to be made pre-season.

I think the fixture against Warrington on the first day of the new season for us, is a massive one. We dont always start the season well, when on paper, we should realistically beat the teams we have lost points to in recent seasons. Warrington are overdue a win against us, and i fear if we start slow, then this could be the game where they finally take the 2 points from a visit to Knowsley Road.

We're on about how topping the league is meaningless. That is what you took offence to and that is what lead to this snoozefest.
If it meant that the five games would include a championship winning game, I'd sooner win five. Any time. I'd hate to have won 25 matches and have sweet FA to show for it.

Whether it's right, wrong or indifferent, the system of the Super League in which Saints have been so successful and used to their benefit on numerus occasions allows for a few slip ups.

One day, Stephen, we may engage in a productive discussion, or better yet, something less mundane.

Some of your argument I can stand with, such as the conditions, look at it this way 3 times we had a game in the sun 3 times we won, 2 times we played in the rain 2 times we lost.

But Long and KC past it? Long was by far the best Scrum Half in SL last year and would of been on that Plane to Australia as the starting Scrum Half for England.

KC was also probably the best Hooker in the league last year, setting up tries for many a player. Cloughs hattrick at Warrington ring any bells? His performance at Bradford?

Wilkin had a poor WC, as did Wello, Pryce and Maurie. But then again who really did have a good World Cup? Nobody bar Roby, Graham, Gleeson and possibly Peacock.

Ive changed me mind now anyway. Ive now decided i want us to finish 8th with 16 points. 2 wins against Celtic, 2 against Salford, 2 against Castleford, 1 against Wakefield and Catalans away. I'll be happy as Larry with that!

Can we not add Wigan to that list, or did you not count them because we will beat them anyway

oh come on. Long best scrum half in SL??? behave. Some games he is world class but, as with Pryce, if he doesn't fancy it he is nowhere! You need a consistant sh to make the team work and provide momentum. He rarely takes the line on, has no pace. His defence is also a bit suspect. Robbie is more than consistant, can beat defenders regulary and tackles much above his weight. Remember the altercation he had with Michael Platt? all because Robbie flattened him in a tackle. Long would only have been on the plane to Aus because of Sky's fascination with your old guard, Long, Wellens, KC etc. KC was ok last year, no more than that. suprised if he starts much next year, I would really start Roby. Although is he a hooker, thought he was a half back??

Clough is ok, i wouldnt rate him any highly than some of our squad forwards. We even played a yawnion convert and he would be as good as Clough, Simon Worrall.

Did Roby have a good WC? Must have missed it. Best in the WC was surely Ganson, he is one of yours! I am not disputing that everyone had a bad WC, i was talking SL. I rated Wilkin until this year. Seems he is a frustrated 6 to be honest. Should play him there rather than Pryce..




Who will play centre now Talau has gone? Have you brought someone in? Who is replacing Fozzy? You might have someone, i'm not sure. Is Tony P a Second Row?

Paul

dont worry about warrington at home or any other possible defeats.the league season is only a 'warm up' for the playoffs.by the time the wonderfull top 8 play off sysytem starts,potter will have settled in nicely,we will have sorted out the left centre problem,pryce will have his 'problems'behind him and our world cup players will have rediscovered their form.i'm telling you,this top 8 was made for us this season.i dont think we will be as consistent this season,but it doesn't matter,this year we will be there when it matters.

the season wont start well,but will improve slowly week by week

In the games against you Sean had Keef in his pocket, if you cannot remember?

His kicking game is second to none and his creativity has improved since he has got older. No pace? Still alright for his age.

I'd rather Roby start before KC this year just so that Roby can get used to starting and that he isn't still known as just an "Impact" player. He was a Halfback when he first broke through but was a better Hooker.

Clough has a habbit of turning and twisting in the tackle which allows him to get a quick PTB in. Probably could start but for Flannery.

When you went to talk on about Pryce and Wilkin I thought you was on about the WC

. Still someone who played badly can't of been voted for MoS for no reason

. Wilkin could possibly be a Stand Off if he had a bit more pace and a better kicking game.

Suposedly Gilmour or Wheeler will play Centre this year according to talk on here. Puletua is a prop/second row, so it will be interesting to see where he plays.

Why would a SH have a Centre in his pocket?? I am not Keith's biggest fan, like a lot of your team, he has flattered to decieve in recent years. Maybe that's Long's problem? he should have the opposing SH in his pocket. He wouldnt be able to catch Robbie. Didnt see much of him having 'Keef' in his pocket in the one game that mattered!

Pryce was a runner for MOS, just as amusing as Graham getting it and Roby the year before, seems only Saints players can be in the running for it. Along with the token Rhino. Phil Clarke must decide who wins

Pryce plays well in games he fancies, never in the big ones that matter. It's easy to be good against Cas when scoring 50 or so isnt it?? (substitute Cas for whoever!)

I said Clough is ok, just not world class. Cant see him breaking too many doors down next year. Not better than any of our squad forwards, people like Biffa, Ian Kirke, Simon Worrall.

You'll have same problem as us in the centres next year, playing someone out of position. But there are not many good ones left. Another suprise was letting WT go. Makes you wonder how close to salary cap you have been or are???

If you want, even some of your fans are saying the same. Should ask the 0000's that left before the end of the GF for the 2nd year running! But that's right, you came top!!! So you win!

you would be if you won the league from 8th

longy defends in the centre position,opposite senior.the only time senior had any room to play was when he was moved during the grnd final,away from long.understand now?

But you wont be champions if you dont finish top ................

Ah, but he wasnt moved because Long "had him in his pocket". And i dont think it was Long alone doing the tackling, watch the DVD!! Keith was moved because you were running riot down the other side and his experience would help Ryan Hall, remember his try!! Keith gave the pass for it. Once we moved the centres and took Ablett off you were not as potent. A spot of genius by Bluey!