Which would seem counter productive. Masoe is already gone at the end of the season, rumour is flash is gone to (Salford muted). Burns has another two year big deal in the bank & will be laughing his head off & Swift will be one of the lower earners.

He's got an issue with JT at the moment so one will be him no doubt, the others should be Walsh, Les Dawson & himself. The juries out at the moment on all four

Are we talking about players who aren't putting a shift in or are we talking about ability here?

From what I can see, Flash is a workhorse who tackles everything he can and is always willing to put his hand up for other roles even though he probably isn't the best rugby player you'll see. Swift scores tries, defuses bombs and is always willing to run it out of the 20 whilst that lazy 'I'll bother to play when I want to' Masoe watches on.

Burns also puts a shift in but currently his game management and contribution to the attack is a bit poor.

This thread just seems to be turning into a free for all swipe at the players that people don't particular rate than actual effort.

Don't panic, everyone! JT is here to save the day... www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/sai ... ?ref=twtre

Don't panic, everyone! JT is here to save the day... www.sthelensstar.co.uk/sport/sai ... ?ref=twtre

You have GOT to be taking the mickey. I won't defend Burns' go-forward. But the guy is always the first man challenging the kick receiver whilst Walsh looks completely out of his depth tackling for most of the game ON THE WING.

How can you have the supposed brains of the side spending half the game on the wing?

The guy can barely walk. He can't tackle at all. His kicking for territory is non-existent.

Right now the only thing standing in his favour is his ability to kick a ball high.

Saints performed miracles last season winning the GF without halves. But you simply can't go through an entire season with no halves. If you could - there'd be no need for them in the game.

Cunningham has to bench the guy for the rest of the season and look VERY SERIOUSLY at whether he's likely to be anywhere close to fit next because with two key players already with question marks hanging over them for next season (Lomax & McDonnell) we simply can't afford a third.

Well looks like the experiment with JT at loose has failed.

The whole team failed. Another one up performance. Totally clueless with the ball. We must have had 5/6 sets on Hudds line at one point.

Jamie Ellis looked better than both our halves.

Yes, the best gauge of halfback play is whether they challenge a kick receiver.

Walsh defends one in from the wing, as do most halfbacks. Burns defends two in from the wing.

Here was me thinking the things you look for in a halfback are organisation, a kicking game, vision and a passing game (and a running game which neither of them have). Yet despite the fact that Burns has played ten more games, Walsh has made more try assists, more tries, more attacking kicks, more clean breaks and a game winning drop goal. But then again, Walsh does defend out wide, along with every single other halfback...

It's crazy to move Turner to loose (in the second half!). I said we'd be just as leaky down that channel and we were.

To be fair - it was a tough game. Huddersfield were coming with form - but more importantly a settled side. This is something we've just not had in ages.

Can't fault the forwards. Yes, some individual mistakes were made. But the real issue is the link play between the backs and the forwards. It's non-existent.

I think Walsh is struggling so badly with his fitness and lack of confidence that his head for game tactics is completely fried. Danny Brough didn't have to do a great deal to play him off the park.

Toothless, boring, one up rugby. Walmsley and Roby doing most of the graft again. And terrible discipline...we gave away so many needless penalties.

That performance was so bad even Stevie Wonder would have covered his eyes.

The fundamental metric for a rugby league PLAYER (before we even begin to talk about positions) is his ability to contest physically.

Burns can.
Walsh can't.

We where shocking again. No organisation or direction when he have the ball. Someone mentioned that we can 5/6 sets on their line and we only scored from a cheeky drive/scoot. I still think we look shot and tired before we even kick off. Could training be an issue? Also I noticed a little bit of in fighting during stoped play, mainly between Swift and Jones. Either way we need to get a few basics sorted and build. It's starting to feel like Royce is back.

I found that Turner changed our game for the 1st 20mins of the 2nd half. Then we went craps again

The whole squad needs wholesale changes, but we have spent badly on 18 fullbacks, so I guess we shall have to make do.

Walsh's defence cost us the game against Leeds. He did his best to cost us the game against Wire and he did nothing tonight.

All the talent in the world counts for naught if you aren't willing to and/or capable of competing.

And no - not every halfback in the league defends (poorly) on the wing. Keep up.

I don't think this is true at all. I mean, sure - it would be great to capture one or two new signings. Maybe we will. I don't know.

But right now I'd just settle for a season in which we aren't blitzed by lengthy (or worse - season long) injuries to key personnel.

It's no co-incidence that Huddersfield's form has peaked - precisely at a period when they've had a settled side.

Aside from the first five games we've not had a settled side all year.

Excuse after excuse. Every team has injuries throughout the season. We're not a special case. Hull brought a team last week that were missing seven players.

The rugby is BORING Muggers. Unimaginative, one up rubbish.

I think the effort is there. It's been there all season. What's missing is leadership, direction and tactical awareness.

Injuries are random events. So - no. Injuries are not spread equally across all teams throughout the season.

But even if they were - losing your first choice scrum half for twelve months is a hell of a lot more problematic than losing your first choice winger.



So? Over the years I've seen sides full of reserves win games. This doesn't mean any of them will start six weeks later when the first teamers return.

The clue is in the word - "competition".



What, I'm the coach all of a sudden?

.....you probably wouldn't do any worse

I'm sure fans of every single club believe their team has been hit hard by injuries. Obviously we focus more on our own team.

I'm getting bored of injuries being used as an excuse now.

Do people want the midget Quinlan kept on next year ?

same old excuses from same people.

We've got a full complimant of props, we have not got one single prop missing. We have all three centres fit plus our back up in dawson. We even dropped one centre in Jordan Turner. We have had both halves back for past 5 weeks. We now have tommy back so both first choice wingers playing. Only Vea missing from Backrow but superstar greenwood and the Lms in there so pretty well covered.

We have a virtual full line up and settled team.

No excuses! The players, the coaching staff are the ones to blame, not injuries or any other excuse these posters can invent.

There's a number of issues at the minute for me.

Walsh has not come back the same player he was prior to the injury, he's out of form and isn't directing the side around.

Burns is not the player that was described when we signed him (others will probably say 'I told you so'), but whilst he appears indestructible, he's next to useless in directing the team around (and to think some on here wanted him to be captain at the beginning of the season because he shouted at Vea in a scrum). He's been a poor signing so far.

Wilkin is injured, it's not a coincidence that we've fallen to bits during the period he's been missing. He's the only other player, bar Walsh, that can effectively direct the team around the park.

Confidence looks shot, especially in defence. Players are second guessing themselves, hesitating, trying too hard, etc. all over the park and it's leading to easy tries being conceded.

The first three things Cunningham can do little about, I'm one of those that doesn't like kids being chucked into weakened sides unless it's necessary, but the last one, the confidence is his (and the coaching staff) job to change. It's not working at the moment, and changes need to be made, but I don't think that's necessarily him being sacked. He needs to learn from this experience.

Next Year!!, I wouldn't want him in the next game. Swifty was playing full back,wing and prop forward last night whilst Quinlan was tackling an "invisible man" and not interested in a decent kick return. We don't have a decent offloading game now, so Quinlan is very much negated and a passenger who can catch a high ball with nothing to offer after that.

I couldn't care less whether you think it's an excuse or not. Right now the truth is that we have one functioning halfback. And he's injured.

How we have arrived at this position is an entirely different question. But it doesn't make it any less true.

And if teams could play successfully without halfbacks for any length of time - there'd be no need for halfbacks.