|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 549 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
May 2011 | 14 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2013 | Mar 2013 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Who will pick the players to send brown rush or Talbot
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 162 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2012 | 12 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Sep 2016 | Sep 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SaintsFan"Like I said, Saints were insisting on their own coach at Rochdale.
I find that rather arrogant.'"
It says this on Rochdale's website:
"Hornets have agreed with the Saints' recommendation of up and coming young coach Ian Talbot as heading up the coaching team for the 2013 season".
My understanding is that they were looking for a new head coach for next season. The U20's has been scrapped and so therefore Ian Talbot was effectively out of a job and so Saints recommended him to Rochdale.
I think he has been assistant coach in the U18's and for the last 3 or 4 years he has been head coach of the U20's. Saints obviously think that he could now move up to the next level. It seems that Rochdale agreed with this. There is no suggestion of Saints insisting on their own coach. So your accusation of arrogance is ridiculous.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 10399 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SomersetSaint"If I was a Rochdale fan, I'd want to watch a successful side. I wouldn't care if the coach wa talbot or calland so long as they won. Problem will come if talbot turns out to be a loser, do Rochdale sack him, or do saints? And who appoints his successor?'"
Exactly, recruiting players and of the right quality is a majr priority for any sports club.
Rochdale supporters can now be excited about the fact that they're likely to have a handful of players who are on the fringe of a superleague squad (fit, strong, proffesionally trained lads who are likely focussed on building a career in rugby league). They also have access to a coach that has been in an enviroment learning his trade with a Superleague club, so likely has seen more cutting edge practises.
I'd say its quite a boon for the club and that, given we have one of the better youth production set ups, clubs associated will do well out of us.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 885 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
May 2008 | 17 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jun 2021 | Jun 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| So all Saints players who are 20+ years old and not one of the five allowed to play for Rochdale are expected to be playing for Whitehaven or not playing at all. What happens with all the players reaching 20?, are they just surplus.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 10399 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="roader"So all Saints players who are 20+ years old and not one of the five allowed to play for Rochdale are expected to be playing for Whitehaven or not playing at all. What happens with all the players reaching 20?, are they just surplus.'"
I guess if they don't make that cut, then yes, they will be surplus to Saints. They'll have to find themselves a new club, I suppose. That's no big loss to Saints, but its not great for RL as a whole.
Its may help bring on these slow bloomers better by forcing them towards looking for first team action for lower league clubs in a sink or swim situation, but I can't help thinking that most will go back to their amature local clubs and playing for fun.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 2928 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2018 | Dec 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Offside Monkey"I guess if they don't make that cut, then yes, they will be surplus to Saints. They'll have to find themselves a new club, I suppose. That's no big loss to Saints, but its not great for RL as a whole.
Its may help bring on these slow bloomers better by forcing them towards looking for first team action for lower league clubs in a sink or swim situation, but I can't help thinking that most will go back to their amature local clubs and playing for fun.'"
So when wheeler isn't injured, where will he be playing?
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 10399 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SomersetSaint"So when wheeler isn't injured, where will he be playing?'"
Rochdale, i think?
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 2928 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2018 | Dec 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Offside Monkey"Rochdale, i think?'"
Hope their hospitals have been warned, they'll nee to put a bed aside each weekend.
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 8155 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2025 | Jan 2025 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| It seems that Mike Rush won't be involved in coaching perhaps.
In the statement on the club's website they describe Rushy as "Saints General Manager Mike Rush".
That's a move which is hardly unexpected.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 1466 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2022 | Oct 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
|
Quote ="SaintsFan"Exactly. Arrogance.
Mike Rush's coaching was pretty turd but would we like it if Rochdale Hornets sidelined him and appointed their own coach over our players? No. We wouldn't. (Well, actually, I wouldn't care a damn but I'd hate the principle of the thing)
It was perfectly possible for Rochdale to have Matt Calland as their head coach and for Talbot to be the youth coach, which is precisely what he is.'"
Why would Saints want a drugs cheat coaching their young players. I doubt Castleford and their drinking culture did anything for Scott Moore.
www.examiner.co.uk/huddersfield- ... -13206756/
Ensuring that our juniors get coached properly is not arrogant it is professional. Rochdale will get a lot out of the partnership. Good coaching, better training facilities and some extra fans. I will definitely make my way down to Spotland next year.
|
|
Quote ="SaintsFan"Exactly. Arrogance.
Mike Rush's coaching was pretty turd but would we like it if Rochdale Hornets sidelined him and appointed their own coach over our players? No. We wouldn't. (Well, actually, I wouldn't care a damn but I'd hate the principle of the thing)
It was perfectly possible for Rochdale to have Matt Calland as their head coach and for Talbot to be the youth coach, which is precisely what he is.'"
Why would Saints want a drugs cheat coaching their young players. I doubt Castleford and their drinking culture did anything for Scott Moore.
www.examiner.co.uk/huddersfield- ... -13206756/
Ensuring that our juniors get coached properly is not arrogant it is professional. Rochdale will get a lot out of the partnership. Good coaching, better training facilities and some extra fans. I will definitely make my way down to Spotland next year.
|
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 16170 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Noel Cleal"Why would Saints want a drugs cheat coaching their young players. '"
Saints were quite happy standing by another kind of cheat when it suited them. Longy served a lengthy ban if memory serves.
Quote Ensuring that our juniors get coached properly is not arrogant it is professional. .'"
And you know that Matt Calland, with assistance from Saints, wouldn't have coached them properly how exactly?
|
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 1466 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2022 | Oct 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="1984saints"Do we think Rochdale fans are going to play 15 quid to watch a team with five saints lads in this could be different lads every week and they will be coach by a saints coach I can't see them getting many fans thro the gate'"
I know. How violated must the Preston North End fans have felt when Manchester United gave them David Beckham for a few games.
I suspect that the same players will turn out for the same clubs. With the better players honeymooning in the lakes (poor bar stewards). Ashe, Forster, Greenwood and Maggenis, assuming he is still at the club, would be good candidate.
As for Gary Wheeler I am sure he will be at Saints full time, probably at right centre.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 1466 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2022 | Oct 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SaintsFan"Saints were quite happy standing by another kind of cheat when it suited them. Longy served a lengthy ban if memory serves.
'"
And Gleeson got shipped off. While Long is the only one of the big three not to have a job at the club (currently). Other players like Moore and Bannister have been released for doing less than Calland.
Quote ="SaintsFan"
And you know that Matt Calland, with assistance from Saints, wouldn't have coached them properly how exactly?'"
I don't know if he would or would not do a good job and more importantly neither do Saints. But Saint do know Talbot will do a good job. A good professional that I have had the pleasure of watching a number of times. He has also never been banned for drugs or betting against his own team, which is a plus. Calland has a role at Rochdale so Saints can see how he does in that role. If he plays his cards right it could be a great move for him.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 12738 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2024 | Aug 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.
Same goes for other young coaches.
At present its basically SL or bust for wannabee top line coaches. The likes of Shaun Wane have gone from being under 20 coaches to being in charge of some of SL's best players. That represents a massive step up, and im sure Wigan would have preferred Wane to have made an interim move to coaching say Leigh (while still employed by Wigan) so that he could find his feet there, before being thrown head first into SL.
This is how the aussies work with their system. They also use SL as a final finishing school.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 16170 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="The Chair Maker"This is how the aussies work with their system. '"
That doesn't make it better.
Once we start to think for ourselves again, like grown ups should do, we will start making progress IMO. At present though there is this ridiculous notion that just because it happens in Australia it is the best and we should follow without question.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Player Coach | 16170 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jul 2008 | 16 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2016 | Oct 2015 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="The Chair Maker"If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.'"
So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 2928 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Feb 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2018 | Dec 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SaintsFan"So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.'"
I really don't see why it is using. If it works well, it will be a symbiotic eelayionship that both sides benefit from. I would be more worried as a Rochdale speccie if saints weren't taking it so seriously. In the end, it will only benefit saints if it improves Rochdale, it certainly is of no use to saints if Rochdale go down the tubes.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 6668 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Sep 2010 | 14 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Sep 2023 | Jun 2023 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="SaintsFan"So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.'"
Knock knock...
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 1466 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2022 | Oct 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="The Chair Maker"If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.
Same goes for other young coaches.
At present its basically SL or bust for wannabee top line coaches. The likes of Shaun Wane have gone from being under 20 coaches to being in charge of some of SL's best players. That represents a massive step up, and im sure Wigan would have preferred Wane to have made an interim move to coaching say Leigh (while still employed by Wigan) so that he could find his feet there, before being thrown head first into SL.
This is how the aussies work with their system. They also use SL as a final finishing school.'"
Excellent point, I had only been thinking about the players.
Quote ="SaintsFan"So you are happy to use the Championships in the same way the NRL uses SL then? If so, that smacks of the same kind of arrogance.'"
Superleague is a feeder league for NRL coaches. No amount of sticking our heads in the sand and being offended is going to change that.
If we don't like that trim the league down to 8 elite teams, split the sky money 8 ways and increase the cap to between £2 and £3 million. But that would upset some people so we cannot possible do that can we.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 32361 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Oct 2002 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Dec 2024 | Dec 2024 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="The Chair Maker"If Ian Talbot does well at Rochdale coaching the team there, then it also opens up a career pathway for him to bigger and better things.
Same goes for other young coaches.
At present its basically SL or bust for wannabee top line coaches. =#FF0000The likes of Shaun Wane have gone from being under 20 coaches to being in charge of some of SL's best players. That represents a massive step up, and im sure Wigan would have preferred Wane to have made an interim move to coaching say Leigh (while still employed by Wigan) so that he could find his feet there, before being thrown head first into SL.
This is how the aussies work with their system. They also use SL as a final finishing school.'"
That's not quite true though is it (or you are purposely missing parts out)
Wane went from U18 coach, winning their Grand Final, to U20's coach, winning their Grand Final(s), to assistant coach winning their Grand Final and Challenge Cup, before he got the head coaches job.
He's served his time and deserves his chance. It's up to him to take it.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Coach | 10399 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Jun 2005 | 20 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jul 2016 | Jul 2016 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Here's a thought. I've just been reading a thread on the VT about the televising of championship games.
If we've got players at Whitehaven and Rochdale, then, if there were more of these games televised, then would you find extra veiwers in St Helens fans?
If this were the case for multiple championship clubs, would the competetion suddenly become a more attractive proposition for TV companies? Maybe a cheeky bid from someone like Channel 4 or 5 to televise a game a week? Even if it were telvised late at night, it wouldn't be a huge drawback considering how easily people can record and replay programs these days.
The development of the club's youngsters is one of the most interesting and rewarding parts of being a supporter, imo. If our kids were on telly, it would go straight on my Sky+ box.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Chairman | 12738 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Jan 2024 | Aug 2020 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Rogues Gallery"That's not quite true though is it (or you are purposely missing parts out)
Wane went from U18 coach, winning their Grand Final, to U20's coach, winning their Grand Final(s), to assistant coach winning their Grand Final and Challenge Cup, before he got the head coaches job.
He's served his time and deserves his chance. It's up to him to take it.'"
It wasnt meant to be a criticism of Wane, I just think that in a more ideal world Wigan would have liked to have seen Wane cut his teeth at a lesser club such as Leigh. He would then have been better prepared for making the step up to SL. I think its a valid argument to say that Wanes inexperience cost Wigan Grand Final and also challenge cup success.
We in Britain tend to throw managers (in both Sport and business) into a sink or swim environment. Is it any wonder that UK sport is full of oversees coaches and there are now few British run businesses left.
I would also point out that Michael Mcguire wasnt given a head coaches job in the NRL until he could prove he could do the head coaches role in SL. Similar things happen with many other NRL coaches. They go from assistant coach, to SL head coach then NRL head coach.
The fact Wane won academy grand finals doesnt necessarily make him a great coach. He may have merely been a solid coach blessed with a crop of juniors better than all the rest.
While trophies are all that some fans think coaching is about. Its also as much about developing individuals and a team into a better unit.
At the junior levels its nice to pick up the minor prizes, but ultimately its far more important that you improve upon what you are given.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Board Member | 4411 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Mar 2003 | 22 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Feb 2024 | Apr 2018 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
International Star | 549 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
May 2011 | 14 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2013 | Mar 2013 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Dux"According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.'"
Ex saints players Fordham wasnt at saints last season out of the lads that as gone they is only Alex trumpet that played for our 20s last season
|
|
|
Rank | Posts | Team |
Club Owner | 1466 | No Team Selected |
Joined | Service | Reputation |
Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
Online | Last Post | Last Page |
Mar 2022 | Oct 2021 | LINK |
Milestone Posts |
|
Milestone Years |
|
Location |
|
Signature |
TO BE FIXED |
|
| Quote ="Dux"According to Gareth Walker (RL Express journo) on Twitter, a few Saints lads have gone to Rochdale on a permanent basis. Gaz Frodsham biggest name amongst them.'"
You feel the club never wanted to give up on Frodsham. A player of definite quality but has just not been able to get on the field. Warren Thompson is another player said to be on his way to Rochdale. I do not really understand why the club did not give him a chance. Seemed a much better player than Paul Johnson, who has been a success since leaving Saints. In his only first team game against Fev in the cup looked dominant and scored a good try. Maybe Saints feel that these lads have the ability to blossom in the championship. They are at the very least good professionals that can make Rochdale a stronger club.
|
|
|
|
|