My guess would be Robes, given that Jammer has been buzzing in his ear about going over there.

Robes going nowhere. One man club IMO.

I'd say Walmsley. I know the rumours of Lomax to Wigan have been denied, but it won't be long before a Wigan or a Warrington come in for him and why would he want to stay here?

What I witnessed last night was an absolute shambles and I am so glad somebody has highlighted the fact that our biggest problem is NB comstantly changing the team before and during games. There is no more excuses of 'key players' being out injured or NB still settling in, it is clearly evident our biggest problem is we never have no fluidity in our play (attack more than defence) due to his constant tinkering. As far as I'm concerned its now damage limitation with our season, so what I'd like to see is our promising youngsters get a solid run in the team to at least give them good experience for next season and beyond. We have ageing players who under perform each week, and players on loan who are blocking the younger lads progression. At the end of the day it can't get any worse than this season has been so far and although they might occasionally struggle we at least know they want to play for the club and will give their all. If I had the power this is roughly what I'd go with now till the end of the season depending on injuries etc.....
Lomax
Swift
Turner
Percival
Makinson

Wheeler/Hohaia
Yates/Charnock

Puletua
Roby
Walmsley
Sia
Manu
Wilkin

Bench:
Hohaia (if Wheeler was fit)
Greenwood
Thompson
Jones/Walker

I would love to see what other people make of this team and how they think they would actually go!

For me Swift, Percival, Thompson, Greenwood with Wheeler/Charnock possibly being regular selections for the remainder of the season.
Howarth and O.Brien to return to their respective clubs, Lance should be paid off as I don,t think he looks all that interested in playing for the club.

You've basically only changed the halves and started with Walsmsley.

Lets get back to basics this year IMO. We can focus on 2014 when this season ends. Lets pick a spine and stick with it for 2013 and try and build on it. I don't see the point in picking youngsters at 7 when Walsh is coming next year.

I would play wello fullback, its the only position he can play and still does a job there and is safe. I would put lomax and wilkin in the halves as lomax is a threat with the ball and wilkin can lead us around the park. Wilkin isn't a great halfback but he does try and organise us which nobody else can.


I'd like to go with : (bearing in mind we can still make the play offs and anything can happen then)

Wello
Swift
Turner
Percival
Makinson
Lomax
Wilkin
Thompson
Robes
Laffranchi (he's crap but nobody else)
Manu
Jones
TP

Hohaia
Walmsley
Greenwood
Lms

Its not much change but that's the squad we are blessed with but the important thing IMO is getting that spine sorted and getting the balance right. The halves offer so much more than O'Brian and wello does.

We could put the academy out there and it will not change. There is a route and branch issue at the club with the playing staff. The players got Royce sacked. The players show lack of drive and professionalism. The players need a massive clear out. We could all name players who may do ok with better players around them.

Clough being one of them, however the poison looks to have spread and it needs cutting out.

I'd seriously only have a few untouchables.

Lomax
Turner
Roby
Walmsley
Sia
Manu


That's it for me. They are decent quality and they are professionals who show drive. The rest should be all up for chopping. I know this exposes peoples personal favourites, like Makinson, but it also includes my own like Walker and Percival.

To go certainly: Wellens, Meli, Ade, LMS, Laffranchi, Perry, TP, Howarth, Wilkin, Clough, Flanagan,
The rest should be open for discussion but even Percival, Walker, Makinson, Jones should all be considered as under threat.

Brown and the entire coaching staff should also be under consideration as they have performed worse than Rush. Whilst Rush may have had run in's with certain players and was not the most entertaining coach he can drill a side. If a part time stand in can do that, then Brown should be able to at least do that. But also KC has to be brought into this, we can't maintain this attitude of oh they were a great servant, is there a job for them on the coaching staff.

We need to be rebuilt. I'm happy to see if Brown can do this but his lack of awareness of what the fans and club are seeing on the field is scary.

From an outsider looking in it sounds to me as if McManus has had far too much influence on recruitment and retention over the last few years and now you're resorting to signing our cast-offs.

I've been saying the same thing, a massive clear out of the dead wood is urgently needed and I agree with your untouchables but we won't!

We've had the perfect opportunity to get shut of TP, Laffranchi, Perry, wello, Ade, Meli but it seems three of those will be staying. The amount of cap space we would have would have been ideal to being better players than those going out instead of the crap we being linked with.

I've tried to be more positive. Thinking, we just needed time for Brown's idea's to settle in and for players to come back from injury. But Positive thinking will only get you so far.

Brown's comments show that he realizes that the players where poor. But nothing from him about his team selection being poor.

It's fine to say I was not expecting us to be that poor in game 4 or 5. It's nearly the end of the year and he needs to man up and say, I've made some bad choices and this is what I'm going to do to modify my ways.

In fact Pete, you have been right on most things, if I was Eamon I'd be considering offering you a job if Brown can't handle it.

I found the post match comment by Brown very worrying when he said " can't the knock the effort". The was no effort. It was lacklustre with no pride or passion and that IMO is the worst thing from the whole team.

Fair enough, players drop balls, bad passes, miss tackles etc and I can live with that but when a team shows no pride, passion of team spirit is what I can't accept and why I was bouncing last night.

Thought the same myself, I,m just wondering if Brown is lacking in the Passion Department and its rubbing off onto the players. He did show some concern in the media though for the saints supporters, maybe that's because he knows the clock is ticking.

The clock isn't ticking. He's secure in his job. But he will have noticed the booing and the fast, mass exodus so it's politic for him to try and appease the fans.

I agree on the effort comment: one of the elements of that match most at fault was the effort; the complete lack of it. The other element was Brown's stupid tinkering, which I got sick of weeks ago and which continues to undermine our chances.

McManus will have final say on all signings but not sure if he's been picking them or listening to bad advice. On the cast off's front you are correct if some rumours are true, we just need to hope a couple of the bargin basement players turn out to be hidden gems or late developers

I didnt even notice Beumont last night, I didnt even know he played. He should fit in well at saints.

I didnt notice him either but to be fair he couldn;t have been less effective than Howarth or Laffranchi. And I'll bet he didnt make as many cockups as LMS

True.

God we are bad!

I was talking to an ex coach after the game and expressed my doubts regarding NB. The ex coach said he had been talking to Kieran Cunningham who Reckons Brown is the best coach that he has seen during his time at the Saints.

??????? regarding Kieran.

And I'm told the same by players.

Sometimes that maybe because he lets quite a lot go and his staff and players are protected from mediocrity by the boss.

St Helens coach Nathan Disco Brown:

[i"I can't fault our effort, but we never got in the contest. It was our most disappointing performance since I've been here.
"Our attack was poor. They kept kicking the ball behind our wingers and we did it once. They kept forcing us into errors and we weren't smart.
"It was disappointing for the fans because we are capable of better than that. We had been building along nicely recently but we have taken a step backwards."[/i

I sometimes wonder if he's watching the same game as the rest of us. He might not be able to fault the effort but I bl00dy well can. At times I wish he'd just be honest and just say we were terrible.

Compare that to

Wigan coach Shaun Apeman Wane:

[i"It was a poor performance. I thought Castleford were really good. They defended well and handled the conditions better than us.
"I want to commend them because Daryl Powell has done a great job while he has been there and the best team won. Castleford are the best team we have had here.
"We lacked a bit of energy and, if that is because of last Monday, then I expect us to get over that. We are better than that and it will never be used as an excuse. I still expect us to perform."[/i

The more I think about it the less confidence I have in Brown. When the players praise him it might because he's technically great or because he's a top bloke but I'd rather have a winner any day of the week.

It's a sad state of affairs when we are so far behind we can't even make ape man jokes anymore.

No wonder the players praise him - who else would have asked Wello and LaFfranchi to stay on? Who else would have persevered with the old guard and kept his faith in the likes of HiHo etc?

So if the players think Brown is a great coach, were do they think it's gone wrong? The lack of a half back cannot be blamed for a lot of the feeble showings this year.

God knows mate.