It's actually a good point Danny. But no I think McClennan is better than that. But I do think he needs players at the top of their game, hence why he was such a good international coach. And he still had players at the top of their game here at Leeds. But personally as the players are losing some of that hunger or vigour, he appears to be struggling to get the best out of them. Only time will tell I suppose.

My point was shamelessly stolen from someone else but I liked it.



I'm still not worried. There is more than enough quality still in this team to mount a serious end of season challenge.

Not dissagreeing with that. My thoughts were more on next season and beyond rather than this.

What are your thoughts on Mick Potter?

He's been brought in to do a specific job at Saints and despite their fans bleatings I think he's managing it well.

Different type of coach. From being in both their company I found TS compelling to listen to and talk to, BM seems like a really nice guy but not as assured in his knowledge. Of course I could be wrong but it's the impression I get

I think he is doing a better job than given credit for. He took over an ageing squad with a smaller squad than leeds, and still got them more than competing. But again, I don't think he could take Saints to their previous levels.

He was brought in to rebuild the squad. I think that's as far as it goes.

Never spoke to either at great lengths but I get the impression Smith is attention to detail and McClennan is motivational. I may be wrong, that's just the impression I get. Of course, no coach can be 'just motivational', there has to be something else there to get back to back titles.

I'd go along with that,i'd also add that our discipline seems worse under BM than TS during the earlier months of the season.
Saying that he's got us ready for "the big one" twice in a row which TS never did not that i'm bagging TS.
It's generally accepted that it's harder to "retain" a title than it is to win one especially when all the opposition are strengthening and improving year on year.
This could be a pivotal year in that we could lose some very pivotal players who have played massive roles in our success the likes of Senior,Ali and Donald plus the expected departure of Buderus will free up some serious cap money.
We've re-signed Smithy which is a great move imo but the others are no nearer to re-signing or been replaced to our knowledge at least.
This could be one of the biggest player turn arounds we've had in the last few yrs and could prove interesting and challenging to the coach.

I think that could be to his benefit rather than anything else. If I was coach I would have wished for a couple more out of contract.

A complete over-haul then?
How many would you let go and who would you target as replacements?
Iirc we have Disko,Bailey,Ali,Senior,Donald,Buderus all OOC at the end of the season all who started the season as 1st choice 17 players who else would you want to release because as i see it that's a big turn around already even if a couple stay.

Not necessarily a complete over haul. Is Diskin really out of contract at the end of the season?

The coach as to work with the contracts he's got. Its' people under contract that are his problem.

Out of those you have to let Donald, Senior and Buderus go. In an ideal world and you were confident of Buderus producing you would give him another year and let Diskin go. But whatever, the first 3 gives us a lot of cap space to play with.

In hindsight though we should have been in a position to let Kirke, Kylie, and possibly Webb go too. I would certainly let Kirke and Kylie go and bring in a quality prop.

I still think this team could be absolute world beaters with a quality half back to partner Danny, whether that is a scrum half or stand off. With the cap space created we could do that, but we have Burrow holding up the position.

I don't think Watkins will be ready for next season, and for the life of me don't want to see Senior for another year, so something needs to be planned there.

AFAIK yeh Disko is out of contract.
I can see yer point re-Kirke and that could still be possible if Manning "steps up" and the hopefull improvement of Ambler and Amor.
It certainly makes it interesting i think Mcshane will cover the loss of Buderus and the Senior situation is one that creates a situation for the coach and club to solve i.e Will they retain him?,Will coady prove he's worth a go? or you could sign someone new also they may consider switching Smith or Delaney.
As for HB i don't know the quality of the acadamy lads in that position but it would be nice to have "cover" but i don't think Burrow is done at all as we discussed earlier on another thread.

Totalloiner said Kirke wasnt good enough about a year ago. I argued he was. He was probably right tbh.

A year ago he was good enough, it's his form this year that has slumped alarmingly but he's not on his own in that regard.

Was he good enough because those around him were carrying him or was he really good enough?

I thought he was good enough but perhaps I was wrong. Unbelievable I know but it sometimes does happen

i think a bit of both the fringe players tend to play well and in some cases above their natural talent when you have quality performers playing at their peak around them.
I still think he will come good but when everyones fit i don't see him as 1st choice 17.

did kirke ever have a long enough run to look bad without breaking his leg and coming back for the playoffs?

Thought Kirke has made short, but significant, contributions to the last two GF's and been a solid squad player in the past. He's clearly not a starting back rower and looks to be off the pace this year. There are some guys that can lift their game in a champion team but drop a level when a team is playing poorly and not really offer much of a lift. When the team's playing well he seems to fit okay, and as we've seen this year when the team's struggling he struggles more than most.

Let's see what he looks like if we hit some form.

That was always my view.

He's jonny average who has been riding the coat tails of a great team.

The job he does, can be done by a kid. Jesus H, I reckon I could do 4 hit ups in a game.

Is he in the academy?

I think he is, although he's always got his Dad's carpentry firm to fall back on if it doesn't work out.

You're thinking of his step Dad. His real Father makes Damo look like a workaholic. He did 6 days graft ages ago and that's been it since. Lazy sod.

I always think of Kirke as a useful fringe player. I wouldn't play him every week but I think he's useful for rotation without risking a young lad.
Obviously he's out of form at the moment but I think that could be said of many players, and I'd agree that when the team steps up he seems to as well.