Yeah i mentioned the change of coach getting more out of the existing players

With regards the signings, i dont think anyone can complain, we'r signing as good a level a player as we can realisticly expect, in merrins case maybe a higher level of player any of us would expect to be coming over here. Injuries happen, clubs can only put together as good a squad as they can and hope for the best on that score, Merrin might play every game and so might ward and watkins , then we'd be instantly a better team than last year. Hurrels a better than moon but in reality moon played very few games at and certainly not paired with watkins, Hurrell and Watkins is lightyears ahead of any combination we put out last year. Loloheas a much better six than either one of moon or suttcliffe and merrin will be, on paper, our best forward and a much needed leader, i dont expect him to be garbutts replacement, think that players still to come in. Agree briscoe or handley are massive drop offs from hall.

With the squad we'v got and the improvment i think furner will bring, i dont think making the playoffs is an unrealistic expectation.

For sure, especially as it's now top 5.

I get what people mean with the style of play, but I don’t think it’s possible to play beautiful rugby whilst getting beaten most weeks. In order to play, we still need a platform set by the forwards and momentum established, and to be winning basically.
It may well take another season to complete the transition but we should be competitive even next year.

We haven’t played good rugby in a number of years, even when winning. I think that is more what is spoken of.

I too would have liked us to have signed two big props. However the new recruits are quality and under Furner we could adapt our attack to major on the backs and be less reliant on the big middle men which we really have not had since JP and Kylie left.

I remember the days of coach Roy Francis and what many consider to be the the most entertaining rugby Leeds have ever played. We went for speed, handling skills and great back up and destroyed opposition with this approach. With the current game mired down with congested defense and one up rugby the game it is crying out for a change.

Perhaps some deeper attacking lines, especially from scrums, and longer missed passes will release the backs into space and we can then run opposition big men breathless.

I remain an optimist.

I also hope that these new signings don't sustain long term injury's early on and "out for 12 weeks "etc and turns into season ending. Hope we have better luck with injury's in general basically

Lots of valid points in this thread and also a lot of things I agree with. In terms of hopes I think the following for me, appreciating a lot are interlinked:

1. We play a better brand of rugby. What I mean by this is rugby that is entertaining to watch and makes me look forward to going to a game or watching it on TV. Some part of this involves an attacking structure of some degree which I think Furner will bring.

2. We have far less injuries and look a much fitter team. Accept that injuries happen but would hope we generally have better luck with injuries, we look much fitter generally and we don’t have half injured players turning out.

3. We get some spirit and toughness back. This is mainly forward based but I can’t stand watching us getting completely battered in the forwards and generally looking like we are soft. This could have been number one but I would rather watch good rugby, thinking if we play good rugby some level of toughness would need to be involved. I think Merrin could play a huge part in this.

4. We play players in the proper position. Not sure if Merrin is a 13 or 10 in SL. We shall see, but generally players playing in the correct position and using the skills they have. Thinking Ward, Cam Smith and how we use them moving forward.

5. We see more of the exciting youngsters, maybe they get a bit of game time. In and around the first team, pushing up competition and giving us some youthful enthusiasm.

Guys this year will be 100% better, maybe winning the GF in 2017 turned out to be our enigma, it gave us a false sense of security for last season and even with RB and DM moving on McDermott believed we had sufficient talent for last year The biggest changes from last year is in the back room, from the start we simply was not fit enough yet we were losing games by one point or winning games. When the injuries came it all went downhill, replacements coming into the team was not good enough, How many of the fringe players were given pay rises on the back of the last GF win, the worse problem was attitude and the rumours that was going around the place regarding fitness and players unable to play. Whatever happened behind the closed doors the good thing to come out of it was the sacking of McDermott. We now have a back room team who are all pulling in the same direction, quality from the very top with Sinfield and Furner, qualities players now getting back to full fitness and will be ready for the start of the season, some fantastic signings and one more signing to come in should we get rid of some players on the wage roll, Mulalley, Walters, Omondroyde etc. Last year we had a lot of players playing out of position square pegs in round holes this year it will be different, we may not get to the GF or win the CC, but expect a good season. Guys don't expect too much out of our first three games if we win one then great, but if we lose all three lets be patient before we start shouting for Furner to be sacked, it will take time for the team to gel, remember its not how we start its how we finish next season.

I reckon for Mullally, Ormondroyd or Walters to move on, someone's going to have to offer 2 years minimum or a decent pay rise for this year. Is either that likely?

On the “wanting to see good rugby” wish that a few people have. It’s a lot easier to do that if your players are fit, the forwards are on top and the halfbacks are providing a lead. On the first point I’d expect players to be fitter than in recent years. On the second I believe you’re two decent props away from top 5, if you’re not dominating the collision and getting a quick play the ball you simply cannot chuck the ball around and “play good rugby”. The days of Roy Francis are long gone, the space just isn’t there on the field anymore for that brand of rugby unless you’re bossing things up front. On the third it depends how players gel. Lolohea is a bit off the cuff and Myler isn’t really a playmaker. It’ll be interesting to see how they go. I believe they’ll be an improvement on what you had last year.
On whether you can offload Mulally, Ormondroyd or Walters you have to ask who’d take them now? I think you’re stuck with them until someone has an injury crisis come Easter.

Walters and Ormondroyd are championship standard at best. I'm sure there would be takers down there but it's down to the players whether they would be willing to go down a level. I'm sure one of the lower end SL clubs could make use of Mullally.we will have to see what happens over the next few weeks.

Totally agree with this. With regard to the squad players who haven't really cemented a 1st grade place, they'd have the option of not being played all year, or maybe taking a pay cut in order to move forward. It's right that Leeds does the "right thing" wherever it can though; if that means we have an issue through 2019, so be it. Not the players' fault.

Mullally already is with a lower SL team probably on a decent wedge so these type of players could be hard to shift. I have to say though before he joined you he had a loan spell with us and he played very well. Maybe if Firmer changes the style it could these types of players and in turn Leeds.

With the recent announcement on the introduction of the 'Golden Point' for regular games, my hope would be that the team works hard in the pre-season on drop goal practice and game management in the last 10-15 minutes.

This was a major failing for large parts of 2018 and the Middle 8s. I'm not sure any of the halves are good at game management or kicking drop goals. The new rule puts last year's team at a further disadvantage IMO, as it pushes us into a situation in which we're more likely to lose a match than draw it.

i like Mullally, he was a big improve'er in 2017 after the poor 2016 season, he did not step up enough last year though, but then again who did, think he is one of the scapegoats unfairly. Furner maybe can move him on another level or 2.

Whilst I agree fast attacking rugby is easier if your pack is on top it's foolish to take on a more dominant pack up the middle if your forwards are busted and under sized.

Last season for large chunks we was missing our big men in the middle and our coach said after every game we was lacking our middle men yet we still tried to play one man rugby up the middle. It was ridiculous to watch. We appeared to have no set plays, no dummy runners and seemingly no plan.

If you are playing against bigger, stronger forwards you have to move them about a bit.

When people say they want a better brand of rugby it doesn't mean throw it about like a hot potato willy nilly it means play to your strengths, look like you actually worked on something thru the week and have a plan to target the opposition's weaknesses.

When we played the ball last year not once did we have a player moving prior to the ball being played. Everybody stood still. How are you going to break a defence down that way?

Hopefully the new regime will bring some new ideas to the table at least.

arguably we have the two best in super league, it would be nice if we get plenty pf ball to both of them with some space, rather than them getting the ball with the cover defence always already on top of them

Also with the announcement of interchanges dropping to 8 we do need our middles to play longer minutes - getting rid of Garbutt may have been a great move.

With respect to Walters et al leaving, even if they can't get their full contracts paid elsewhere we'd still be better off WRT the cap if we only have to pay part of their wages with whoever they join paying the rest. Its standard practice in the NRL to shift under contract players who they've paid overs for.

The problem with arguing that someone like Mullally is maybe OK is that you could argue that about everyone (except maybe Walters....). Once you start down that route you end up with a whole bunch of plodders, which is where we ended up last year. I accept that we can't move everyone on and some might have to stay until their contracts run out, but our ambition as a club surely ought to be to try to have the best possible players in the squad. Furner seems to have flagged that intent, and hopefully it means no more of the likes of Walters getting games if a youngster with promise could get a game. Its not as though continuing to pick the plodders actually paid off last year.

If we can still snag this specialist prop which has been rumoured, it will be interesting to see if there's a player swap involved. I do think with another prop and Furner's impact, we should at least be highly competitive with this squad, notwithstanding injuries. Getting Ferres, Ward, Watkins, Merrin, Lolohea, Hurrell, Ablett, Cuthbertson fit will be interesting too.

We still need to move on three of the players, Walters, Mullally and Ormonroyd, maybe then we get in the Prop we need. If we can get Ferres fit and back to his best it will be like having a new player available, hopefully the new conditioner will have him fighting fit before the start of the season. All he needs to do then is see a shrink to stop him giving away daft penalties in our half and he needs to ask Ablett to go with him, both are walking penalties. Getting them fit and keeping them fit is key to a successful season. One or two others need to go back to tackle school and lean how to tackle big men and not simply jump in head first. One prop due to sign shortly.

And said prop is rumoured to be from another SL club and will raise a few eyebrows if true.

LMS. That would raise my eyebrows, though not in a good way.

We spoke in 2017 of his development similar to JP’s early career and saw so much potential.....I agree, unfair for him to be treated as a scapegoat - so many of the pack should have that label as well because they were awful. I hope DF sees what we saw!!

I think Seb with Ash G as a player swap (but I want to be wrong!!!)