Agar has done what we needed,steadied the ship.

We need more than that now.

To me watching Agar's side is like watching Kear's sides - very basic game plans and very little attacking structure/flair - it is dull.

However if you change to a coach with a radically different coaching concept and style you can often go backwards as many of the players don't work with the new coach. Where Saints have been very good this time is the change from coach to coach is often seamless same at Wigan when they moved to Wane.

The next coach needs to top draw with a brief to develop the young players no matter what the short term implications are i.e. missing the play offs but they need to develop a style that makes people want to watch the team again.

Thing is there are very few coaches in the game who would be fit for Leeds - and even fewer who are available.

I mean is there an argument that the assistant/technical coaches are more important to get right...? Agar can only give game plans which the players have the ability to fulfil. On the evidence of the 2 Saints games, before Sezer, Austin and Bentley come in, the current squad is short.

I view Agar the same way I viewed Powell in 02/03. He's been the right coach at the right time, but he's not going to be the coach to take us to the next level.
He's done great job, but if we can get a better coach, we should go for it.

The DOR role requires excellent knowledge of the game, really good contacts in Australia, being an excellent judge of a player plus an ability to screw people down on contracts without thinking they've been screwed on their contract.

We've been blessed with pretty much the best in the business doing all that for is for the last couple of decades but he doesn't want to do it any more. I don't know what Agar's negotiating is like but every one in the game says his Rugby League contact list and knowledge base is outstanding so he would seem to have at least a few of the right criteria.

Agree

Very fair view of things - the person I would have liked to have seen as an assistant with a view to the big job was Ryan Carr.

If you look at the spine Myler/Walker both OK, half backs OK, hooker a real problem with both, Loose Cameron Smith OK - Agar can only work with what he has, a one out strategy with a week pack seems a poor choice?

I think think thats very harsh on Leeming.

I have been lucky enough to attend a few of JPs business club events where Agar always comes and visits and discusses his tactics for the game coming up. What impresses me most about him is his knowledge and his view of the opposition, I don't think his tactical awareness can be questioned. The last one I attended was before the Giants game when we had 65% of our cap sat in the stands, how he spoke about how we would go about the game was very evident in the actual match. I quite enjoyed telling everyone who cared to listen about it and you could see it. I fear most of his expansive tactics are dictated by the personal we have available, lucking forward to next season when we have some quality (and fit) halves, Kruise playing 9 and a pack that should dismantle most sides. If he is still HC for next season, lets rate him after that. I think he has done really well for us when you consider the challenges of this season. No way that most of us thought we would make the semis this season.

Leeming has had a very good season, no doubt about that. However, his stand out performances have been as an emergency half. I think he's our starting hooker next year, but in terms of his passing from dummy half(the key skill for his position) I'd give him six maybe seven out of ten. Admittedly that's probably twice has good as our other regular dummy half option. We're all still heaping praise on the clinical nature of Saints performance on Friday, but I can guarantee you they'd be a lot less efficient with our dummy half options. Big Al is not having to pick to many off his boots. Now he may well turn out to be a very naughty boy and not the messiah, but from what I have seen of young Johnson in the academy and in his brief first team appearances the quality of his distribution is top class. He could be a game changer for us.

good answer like the first para

A key element of a top 9 is distribution - Leeming has very poor passing technique - no one can question is commitment and energy but there are questions about his core skills

he persistently takes the wrong option too imo

newton's book talks about studying cunningham and practising passing both ways, didn't tony smith strip coaching back to hammering the basics when he took over

re-read newton's book last week.
its learnings decision making that worries me. he takes the wrong option or the wrong pass far too often

Thought Leeming had a very good season and imo was our most improved player who’s getting better and better. Agars job is to improve his distribution skills through good coaching

I disagree that Leeming has a poor passing technique from dummy half however decision making, game management and passing accuracy could improve and will improve.

Leeming doesnt miss many tackles, no hooker should, but his contact is absolutely terrible and the opposition make 5 yards after he hits them. That shouldnt happen with any defender in the middle of the park. Run at Terry Newton and you got whacked, run at Leeming and its an easy gain and a quick play the ball.

Look, i see lots of potential in Leeming hes our best hooker currently and hes getting better. Hes done his best for the team at half back but is needed at 9.

As for the lad who played 9 Fri, he wasnt to blame in any way for Fri, i wish every player had his attitude and energy but jeez i hope i never see him in a Leeds shirt again. Agars comment of "passing empty crisp packets from dummy half" summed it up pretty well.

I loved the crisp packet quote.

You watch players like Roby, or the NRL sides in action and passes are consistently zipping to first and second receiver just in front of the receiver and right on their fingers. Makes such a difference.

Our poor lads are getting slow passes to their ears and then 3 metres before an organised defence whacks them.

We’re not great at finding quick PTB either.

Hear what you’re saying about contact in D too Marty.

Dwyer really is an impact hooker only. He has wonderful spirit but just lacks outright quality.

Again this put emphasis on our need for another beastly body in the middle. We need to be very direct.

Agree we still need another big one, but even now, with the level of distribution you allude to, we would be 10% better in all aspects of attack.

Problem is without singing a new first class hooker, how are we going to change that?

Dwyer we know about. Leeming is still young enough to hone his craft a bit, and he's decent if not spectacular.

Young Corey could be the answer but not a player right now you'd want to pin the entire future hopes of the club on, with due respect to the lad.

Anyway I would be surprised if we retain Dwyer after next season for these reasons, I'm sure the plan is for Johnson to mature into our #2 hooker for Leeming, and put some pressure on him for selection over the next 12 months so that we can release Dwyer with thanks.

Now we have three decent half back options for 2022, hopefully Leeming gets a good run at 9 and we get some stability and flow to us.

I actually think that the time Leeming has spent in the halves will help develop his game. He's going to have a better understanding of what the halves need to get the team moving. He should also hopefully have a better ability to assess the defensive line too.

Passing is something that improves with practice and technique . Absolutely no o excuse for a hooker to be a poor passer. What have they done in junior rugby and training?

indeed. is he 25? 26? cant see it improving now

How about myler at hooker once Walker returns.
Tough as teak.
Good passer.
Kicking game
I think he would be better than lemming until Corey matures.

He is tough, but he's not tough or big enough to do 40 or 50 tackles in the middle of the field. Walker and Myler need to battle out full back between them. At the moment it's advantage Myler. Hooker wise I would love to see Leeming with Johnson backing him up. Tough on a player of Dwyers total commitment, but if we are going to move forward it's probably a decision that needs making. Another option would be to play with one hooker (Saints and Catalans often do) and have Austin on the bench for some marauding strike. Certainly not short of options.