Dont know what length of contract cross and hauraki are on but I can see us being stuck with them, not sure who would want them.

Hauraki is 26 and was in demand from other clubs than Leeds after an excellent season at Crusaders. Personally, I haven't written him off yet, but if the club do then they'll be able to offload him pretty easily to any non top-5 club.

Cross we're unlikely to be able to unload within Super League.

I'd have him at York.

The Bulls didn't pull the trigger after a year with Joe Vagana or Big Les. We didn't with Scott Donald.

We have options in the pack. We didn't at the start of the year. Because a player may not make the 17 any given week is no reason to bin them. I don't judge Hauraki or Cross any differently from Clarkson or Burgess. They are either at the top of the pecking order at any given time, or they're not. I like that their quota status doesn't come into it.

Why is nobody suggesting we bin Pitts, who regularly finds himself out of the 17, or Smith earlier in the season when he didn't make the 17.

I'd have thought after the injuries we stockpiled in the pack early season and the injuries we're carrying in the backs now Leeds fans would appreciate the value of a squad of players.

But no, as usual, Leeds fans are reactionary. A player has a bad game, he's terrible, he has a good game, he's a world beater, he doesn't make the 17, get shut of him. If GH gets shut of Hauraki and Cross and we get more injuries the same fans who bemoaned GH signing them will bemoan the fact that the squad is too small. I expect it from most idiots on here but you surprise me.

I'm not prepared to write off either Cross or Hauraki......yet.

Both had some game time earlier in the season when we as a team were struggling badly and yet both seem to be being made scapegoats.

Fair enough, I agree that your overseas signings should (injury permitting) be amongst the first players down on your teamsheet as otherwise what are they doing here but to be fair to them, both are settling into a new team with new structures etc and with regards to Cross he's having to settle into a new life with a new club in a new Country.

I think if both got a chance in the match day 17 now for an extended period that people's opinions of one/both players may change.

Hauraki had looked good on attack playing in a team that was looking poor earlier on in the season. Granted his defence had and still has weaknesses but i'm sure he and the coaching staff are working on that? Look at McShane, last year when he got a chance many opponents were running over and through him but he seems to have improved his defence.

I'm not sure whether Cross has had some disciplinary issues within the club that have not been let out into he public domain or whether it's simply a case of he was a signing made by our previous coach and Mac doesn't like/rate him? However when we have had rare sightings of him I think he was looking decent as the team were getting better. I seem to recall that in away games at Bradford and Cas he looked more than useful with the promise of more to come but after that Cas game he seems to have gone off the radar just as he seemed to be 'warming to the challenge'

As fans it seems a lot of us are constantly looking to slag off the players and Senior, Bailey, Kirke, Burrow and Smith have all had their fair share of flack in the last 18 months but it seems that our overseas signings come in for even more stick and unless they are ripping up Super League from their 2nd game onwards they are written off by many.

Eastwood was slagged off last year and despite his 'off field' issues no one can deny that apart from maybe Peacock before his season ending injury he was the most dominant member of our pack (2nd half of the season) and produced the goods on the pitch more times than not (accepting his brain fart in the CC semi

)

Buderus had and still has his fair share of knockers but IMO is one of our better performers on a consistent basis.

Kylie and Donald were both written off as next to useless in their first half season here and yet look how they both turned out with I'm sure most agreeing/accepting they have turned out more than OK.

IF Cross is happy in the UK and the club are happy to keep him I think he will settle down and become a valuable member of our pack over the next 2 years.

Maybe part of the reason for getting him in now was an expectation that both Burgess and Kylie are going at the end of this season with maybe JP at the end of next and possible departures of Kirke and/or Bailey who are both out of contract (?)

With regards to Hauraki, IF he sorts his defence out I'm sure he too will be an asset long term.

Players do and can improve.

Look at the difference in Burgess this year compared to previous seasons and how Kirke has produced better performances these last 4/5 matches. Hell even Bailey has looked half decent the few times he's been spotted on the field this season



Patience can be a wonderful thing.

A squad is vital, no doubt.

From my point of view, Ambler (and or Amor) could offer to Leeds what Cross has offered.

Because of recruitment of players like Cross (sub-standard) the other above mentioned players find their way out of the squad contention and are used like Blockbuster videos.

So getting Cross in to play like Cross does is moot, because it was covered already. It would have just meant retaining players within our squad who we already made the effort to scout and sign instead of farming them out.

As for Weller he is a defensive liability. Who on form is my last choice second rower compared to Ablett, Clarkson, JJB, Ali, Pitts and Kirke. Was he signed to be 7th choice second rower? I hope not.

As for Pitts, what is expected here? Alot of time has been put on his development and could be classed as a cheap experiment. He wasn't a SL regular when we signed him, and he continues not to be.

Could we live without these 2 in our squad over a season? By keeping certain others it would assist a great deal.

Knowing that Peacock would be unavailable for the first part of this season I considered it a prudent move to recruit short term to maintain a healthy squad......but then ( and here surely is the main point ) the club shipped out Ambler.... A guy who could have done just as good a job and might even now be commanding a first 17 place.

Hauraki has been another disappointment, but I can better understand his recruitment.

perhaps the coaches thought ambler and amor not good enough.

just a thought........

I needn't have bothered posting... Bloodbath covers it all here and more.

Hauraki seemed to offer an exciting youngish attacking option....we have more than sufficient workhorses to choose from in the second row. Obviously no one at the club had yet seen ( in contrast to Bloodbath and myself of course ) Delaney's future being in the second row and that it was in effect a centre we needed. Still do.

What is really puzzling is that none of the clubs - including Leeds - chasing Hauraki seemed to pick up on his defensive liabilities ... Why? ?

The frustrating thing about both players signing for me was we didn't really need them, and had players in the team of the same standard or better already

..... And they thought Cross could offer so much more it was worth blocking their progress AND blocking up a quota spot ??

Kirke is 'upping' his efforts to win a new contract.... Will it last ? Or should the club recognise its past mistakes and elevate the likes of Bradley Singleton into the first team squad.....? and Steve Ward ... And Wilson ....etc ( you get my drift )

You gave him his full Sunday name!

I am sure he will be in the 1st team regardless of kirke.

Also agree re blocking progress of youth and quota

Eastwood was the correct type of choice of signing.

Higher end, had the flair alongside the power, big unit, ticked more boxes than he had big fat crosses.

Problem here was he didn't want to be here.

God knows!!

Who'd be a coach!

They must have made the decision. I'd agree.

But was a 30+, NRL squad player, with under 100 games under his belt, the best option?

I dont think so no. Not a bad player, better than some on here think, but there were better options

Or did we leave recruitment far too late and got what was left?

We did .....and it appears we might be in line for the same again.

Rather than making average antipodean signings for the sake of it, in an attempt to justify this year's GH freebie down under... the club really should not bother.

With Origin experience too. On paper looked a decent signing at the last minute to cover the large hole in our pack left by Eastwood. Hasn't worked out so far, but he could still make a useful contribution later in the season.

I think our in-house options wasn't bad.

An ideal prop pack of Kylie, Freak JP, Biff and TMFISL is very handy to say the least.

But as G-Spot alluded to the strength in depth will always be tested. With the international on the horizon it will be intresting to see if Leeds postpone or carry on regardless. If Leeds get by in the cup against Hull and we make the semi, a win or a loss would work out. As a win sees us back at wembley but a defeat would make for a sensible opportunity to squeeze in a postponed round of rugby. Again another tricky decision to possibly make.

In related pack gossip, are we presuming Biff is getting cleaned out? I know Mac said a few weeks ago he may need some minor surgery, with getting JP and Bails back that opens the door for that. It has all been a bit hushed though.

He flirted with State Of Origin, that's true. Quite an achievement.

O'Hara and Cashmere also dipped their toes in that scene and are very no frills, grunty, physical, players. That's the player I was hoping for with Cross.

And from what I've seen of him in our 1st team and what I saw of him on Saturday a far better option than Amor.

It's fairly obvious the club thought Amor and Ambler weren't ready yet. I see no reason to think they got that wrong. So they brought in Cross. FWIW, I thought Cross was doing a decent enough job up to his omission, the odd brain fart apart (and all players have those, even TMFMISL).

There's something else springs to mind here. Do people remember what everyone was saying about peacock during his first season here? They were wrong but many posters on here were questioning the signing. They didn't know what to expect from a big name signing who was a prop. Same applies with Cross (not that is is in JPs league or a big name signing).

Good to see you supporting our antipodean contingent.... Although it only apparently extends to the average-at-best element at the moment.

Completely agree regarding amor, but not so sure any better than ambler.
TBF cross hasn't puzzled me as much as hauraki,.

On the last bit I think we are streaching. The definition of big name signing as prop!

Could our marque signing for next year be a certain Matt Cooper?

Why? He's another left centre. We may as well right off any chance of Watkins developing there if we sign another one. I also suspect Senior will be back.

Also interesting to see Morgan of KR saying overseas players are becoming too expensive. Excellent.