Burgess's first major contributions to the game were 2 dropped balls and a penalty conceded (and I'm sorry but you have to be awake at international level - even I knew McGuire was going to offload from the tackle, they were the sort of passes that were sticking in the second half).

Burgess was sloppy against France as well and dropped planty of ball, but somehow nothing sticks on him at the moment.

Quite. I think he's been trying a bit too hard. His ball security is terrible. The rest of his game is great though. But, at this level, being as far behind in talent terms as we are, he cannot turn the ball over as much as he has been doing.

And if one eyed Wigan fans think its' Sinfield and McGuires fault that Tomkins couldn;t get his hands on the ball for 50 mins then you have to question whether the kid is up to it yet. Do you think Andy Gregory would've let other players monopolise the ball?

Tomkins is not yet a dominating half back. He was completely overawed in the 1st half. The only people to blame for that are Tomkins himself and Smith for perhaps selecting him when he wasn't ready.

2nd half, Tomkins was much better but he will have to develop more to his game than that predictable step.

i cannot belief mags has been slaughterd yes he didnt play is best game for country but to write him of no.I think smith got it wrong playing jp 2nd row he defended too far in leaving argubly the worlds best player inglis and slater to have one on ones briscoe should have come in and forced the aussies to go round them a sliding defence which is used every week at leeds.The 2 new halves eastman and tomkins were good in last 25mins when we had more ball and all bares well for future.Sam burgess came to leeds with bradford this year and was slaughterd about his performance and was taken of ,yesterday he looked every inch the great young prospect he no doubt his .Point is class is permanent semi final last year mags was our best player for england the player andrew johns was raving about fact, he has scored in grand finals world club finals test matches against any country, fact still only 26 so come on lets get of his back .

The reason Tomkins was not seen in the first half was because our pack was getting destroyed. The introduction of Crabtree and Burgess, gave us a bit of grunt up front as they didnt seem intimidated by the Aussies. Also good ball from Sinfield at Hooker meant Tomkins was in the game more.

Absolutely spot on

with 3 titles on the trot, the knives will be out for our players and that's the agenda people are peddling.

Personally i thought we'd have done better if it wasn't for those stinking saints players.

So its OK for Tompkins to be invisible when our pack are getting hammered, but McGuire gets slaughtered for it.

The problem was, McGuire was invisible even when our pack [iweren't[/i getting hammered! And unlike Tomkins, he's played the Aussies before so there is this expectation that he will actually be able to bring something to the party. Which he profoundly failed to do.

He was poor but the amount of stick he's getting is disgusting, it shouldn't matter whether you've played the Aussies before or not if your supposidly good enough to play test rugby then you should be able "to bring something to the party" Every England player in the first half was shocking with the exception of Crabtree and Sinfield, even Tompkins and Burgess who are getting creamed over were shizz. But it seems to me McGuire is being made a scapegoat for what was a very poor performance from everyone in an England shirt

Maguire was poor and struggled I agree but wasnt helped by Tompkins failure to get into the game early on.

Tompkins didnt get hold of the game from the halves and he should have been expected to from the 1st minute..........in similar circumstances a young Shaun Edwards would have wanted the ball at every opportunity.

I thought once we were beat he came into the game and performed reasonably but you cant start performing at 26-0 down!!

It's perfectly appropriate and personally, I'm enjoying it after our lot got stick last year.

But aside from my vicarious enjoyment, the truth of the matter is that he stood out as having a very poor game - all the way through.

Tell that to Tony Smith. He should have addressed the obvious leak we had in the first half instead of waiting for the Aussies to grab 26 points from us.

That was Tomkins' and Eastmond's first game against the Aussies. I think as young players they did extremely well, especially Tomkins who was given precious little support in the first half by any of the experienced campaigners.

However, like I said, Tony Smith should have addressed our leak in the first half, preferably after the second try had been scored. That was a dismal failure on behalf of our national coach.

who made all the kicks in those first 20 minutes Mcguire & Sinfield did, Tomkins was not allowed near the ball.

the ball never got passed to Tomkins due to the greediness of Mcguire and Sinfield.

That you enjoy England playing badly speaks volumes for your character or lack thereof.

Well, I've heard some arrogance from Leeds fans but that really does push it, even for Leeds fans! Since when has Mcguire equalled England?



I no more enjoyed England's first half performance than did anyone else. I was there and watched it all unfold in the flesh. However, it was great to see the improvement in the England side during the second half. Just a pity Mcguire couldn't have improved with the rest of the team.

I dont think it was a poor performance from everyone in an England shirt, Tomkins, Sinfield, Eastmond, Ellis, Burgess, and Crabtree all played well. The fact is is that we don't have enough good players who can compete with the Aussies on a regular basis. The Shentons, Briscoes, and McGuries are just not good enough, but is thats all we got then we are just guna have to make do.

I think the reason that McGuire is being used as a 'scapegoat' is because he plays in an influential position and he did have a particularly poor game, where if he makes a mistake it is more obvious. He was just one of our players that had a poor game, but I think the fact that Eastmond came on and played SO and did fairly well puts even more pressure on McGuire and should be the reson why he should be dropped.

Poor Little Tomkins. Being picked on by those big mean Leeds players. I hope his brother gave him a big hug and a cup of cocoa when he got home.

He's a good little player, terrier like in defence, but to say that he was kept out of the game by Sinfield and McGuire is a poor excuse. He looked over-awed in that first half, like the rest of the team.

Sounds tasty, where can I get one of these inbreads?

but but but...we all know its true that the halfbacks can only operate behind a dominant pack



so its not McGuires fault but the forwards.

Funny how the majority of the ball went to the opposite side of the pitch to Tomkins in the first 20, when the ball did come his way the passes went to other players, simple as, you condescending buffoon, fact is Tomkins is 3 times the player Mcguire and you arrogant Rhino fans just can't handle it.

come back when Tommo has 12 GF rings...

then you might have some credibility.

Tommo has potential ATM nothing more

A runners up medal would be a start

McGuire had the worst game I've seen him have in years. He's not finished at that level at all, but he will be lucky to get picked next week.

Tomkins IMO was excellent, you can't blame him for the 1st half as we got murdered everywhere, second half he really took them on, get getting picked up and smashed, kept getting back up and going again. Our MOTM IMO.

this has to be one of my favourite threads of all time! My favourite player getting totally vilified for having a poor game!

Reading the vindictive posting about mags and seeing you all w*nk over it tells me all I need to know about said muppits!

Reveling in it like pigs in sh*t

most amusing

Are you copying and pasting this post on every board, you sad muppet?