RR "Tonite was a masterclass on good dummy half play". That was on the back of some real hard yards and great go forward by our pack are you saying when we've been poor its just been down to Mcshane?

No i'm saying that Mcshanes dummy half play has been very slow, that may be a result of poor play by the rest of the team, but even in the games where we have been on top his play has still been very slow, thus making everything else in the team a little predictable!




Are you Pual Mcshane's Dad??????

Tonite's game showed how a good number 9 should play. There were 13.000 witnesses saw how well Lunt went tonite, there are also quite a few on here both raving about lunt/bagging Mcshane! Why have a go at me for doing the same???

It's a lot easier to get good go forward if you've got a dummy half providing quick and accurate service. Lunt did that tonight. From the times I've seen Leeds on Sky this season McShane and Hood have both failed to do this. McShane in particular has looked dreadfully slow both in distribution and movement and Hood looks a lot like a natural athlete learning to play a position.

Hood out on loan to Dews is a great move by Leeds and he'll benefit greatly from it. McShane needs to speed up everything he does otherwise he wont make it as a hooker.

Coincidence or not Lunt showed how it should be done....great distribution. He and Burrow should now be first choice interchange dummy halves on that performance.

Difficult because I would also like to see Hood on that bench every week too.

Either way McShane is now well down the pecking order IMO.

McShane was outstanding against Manly, it would have been hard to fault that performance also. Lunt is a good player, but that effort from he pack tonight was pretty special. When you dominate collisions like we did my mum would look sharp at dummy half.

Lunt's had one good game and McShane - a young player -a few average ones.

The only good option that McShane brings to the party is the odd 40/20. His distribution is slow and his whole play lacks zip. Much is said about him not having enough game time but Lunt showed in one game his class whilst McShane has never managed to show anything more than promise in 30 to 40 appearances since 2009.

Watch his apperances vs Castleford & Bradford both away last season then come back to me.

I did. So McS made a try with a good pass from a PTB against Cas - big deal. He has never given an 80 minute performance like Lunt did in his first game for Leeds and has never shown enough to be rated as anything more than promising. He has sadly failed to show the improvement necessary to make the 9 spot his own and now could be down to 4th choice at Leeds.

Did you see his game v cas away last year?
Did you think he was ordinary v Manly?
Lets also get some perspective here Lunt is 25 and has made the England squad Mcshane in SL terms is still a young lad learning the game and has played a bit part mostly and before you jump in with "because of his form" what did he do wrong not to get picked away at Wigan or after the Manly game when the coach clearly stated he was just "rotating" him with Hood?
Afterall yer posturing over Farrell in yawnion you go and write kid off because someone with more experience has a good debut what next ditch watkins because Ablett has played well at Centre?
I can't wait for your reaction to Lunt when he's poor in cr## team performance wil he get the blame like Macca has?

I just can't ever see mcshane been a regular top performer

3 seasons on the fringes now

Neither had Lunt before Friday. That was the 1st time he'd done 80 mins in his career.

So it was McShane's fault when the pack gets hammered? I haven't seen every game McShane has played, but he did more than "OK" against Manly. His defence, which many have had a go at, was excellent against a far tougher pack than anything he'll face in SL, and he showed a lot of nous at the PTB, freeing Burrow for more of an orthodox scrum half role. What's odd is then dropping him for Hood almost straight after, rather than giving McShane a real run at the role.

If McShane leaves (unlikely for the time being as presumably Lunt is cup-tied) I personally think he has some grounds for complaining that to date he hasn't been given the sort of run he may have deserved and other players have had.

As for Lunt, I'd expect a full international to be able to step in and do a good job from the off. It will be interesting to see how he's viewed when we have the inevitable bad performance with him in the team.

I tend to find we as fans overestimate players on good days ("nobody could have lived with us", "player X is world class"icon_wink.gif, and underestimate them on bad days ("nobody could have lived with them", "player X is useless"icon_wink.gif. The overestimation tends to reach fever pitch with newbies as well.

Apologies - Lunt apparently isn't cup-tied as presumably didn't play for Hudds in the cup.

i maybe wrong but didn't Lunt & Mcshane both make their super league debuts the same year? whilst i think many would agree that macca's had better hookers in front of him, Lunt has had to deal with N.Brown's 'i want half a team of sevens' so its not been a easy walk in the park for him. Paul's biggest issue for mine is his consistency, he very quickly swings from looking a class act to looking like a championship player (sometimes even in the same game), which in a vital position like hooker is never going to win him any brownie points with either the coach or the fans. So whilst yes i agree that there have been some weird team selections around him, like being dropped after manly, you can hardly blame the coach for not trusting him fully and keeping half an eye on what's best for the team not just the player.

as for the centre comment, I'd certainly be weighing up the pros & cons of ablett taking the other centre spot.

agreed. Lunts debut was decent but not world class.McShare played well against Manly but certainly not so well its worth using in a discussion. I do think though that he hasn't had a settled run in the team. you have to ask yourself why.

McShane did get picked for the game at Wigan but coach McDermott chose not to use him from the bench and McShane did get selected in the game following Manly which was away at Widnes. The rotating with Hood started the following week at Castleford and including that game McShane has played in five and Hood four of the Leeds games played since.



Not sure if it would matter even if he had at this stage of the competition after the Hull FC fiasco in 2008 when they played Jamie Thackray in the opening two rounds (that's round 4 and 5 for SL clubs) which led to the rules being tightened.

Either way providing Leeds get past Salford he'd be available from the quarter-final onwards even under the old rules that Hull fell foul of.

Inside the mind of Juan:

Loves - Ben 'Techncially Awful' Cross

Dislikes - Paul 'Potential' McShane.

Dark place isn't it.

I have already said I saw the Cas game and yes McS had a good game. He made a quick pass from the PTB for Hall to score and made one or two good runs from D/half and scored a try against a poor and tired defence. But that day JP was back and Leeds were up for it and Cas were not.

Against Manly he put in a good defensive stint (as did the rest of the team) and he made one good kick. But he only made a couple of runs and a few metres so was good but not outstanding.

I know you have had a man crush (or was it a boy crush) on McS and have been in his corner so to speak but really two good games is all you can come up with since 2009. It is you who need to get some perspective as despite his promise he has not shown enough consistency or class IMO to command his place at 9. He has not shown the decisive quick distribution needed at this level and will be 23 next so really should have made it by now. I am not writing the "kid" off - it is just that I have never been convinced of his pedigree and I guess successive coaches may share my doubts. I really hope he is a late developer and does make it.

Quite how you can equate my support for Owen Farrell, who has class, and was making his International debut at 20 and who had cemented a place in the RU Champions side at 19 with a player who has failed to gain a regular place at Leeds despite making his debut 3 years ago is odd. Farrell proved my predictions to be correct and your judgement to be wrong. He fully justified my comments with his performances whereas McS has not justified your judgement.....yet.

I have rated Lunt quite highly from what I have seen of him at Hudderfield and he showed all the things I look for on his impressive Leeds debut. Are you saying this was a fluke?

I shall not reply to your other illogical ramblings as I assume you had had a glass or two of Rioja

Even more impressive then!

While inside the heart of BB the love pours out for the "technically awful" Bailey

and now do I detect a certain feeling arousing in you for Master "full of promise" McShane. Careful BB... rhinoms will get jealous

I'm a fan of mcshane, and he has shown glimpses of his class, but hasnt been given a sustained run of games to show it on a more regular basis, that said if lunt can keep putting in performances like friday, its going to be hard for mc to get back in. Ive heard that he could be out for a while and may have to go under the knife, not sure if this is true mind

So you play down Mcshanes performance against Cas by saying Leeds were up for it and Cas were not yet big up Lunts efforts against a Catalan team we were CLEARLY "up for" and dominated for most of the game.
Just to add Mcshanes shasrp cut out passes wide created 2 tries aswell as his own and he brought a creative kicking game.
It's amazing how you pass off opinions as some kind of "crush" when you disagree and just because Mcdermott has rotated and in somecases not picked Mcshane doesn't mean he isn't any good especially given how he used the 9 spot last year.
You keep writing the kid off and i'll stand by my opinion and whilst you keep throwing numbers around as some sort of evidence Cross is a good Prop and chelp against Bailey i'll trust my own judgement thanks.
Also IF you think Farrell has proved his class after 5 minutes i look forward to seeing him lead England to a Grand Slam and a World Cup.

I agree with most of what you put, but I think that the argument seems to get hung up on this Cas performance, and the performance against Manly. The Cas performance was very good. His best, but was a year ago against a weak-ish team, and have been the exception rather than the norm unfortunately. The game against Manly was decent but I would hardly consider it worthy of being used as an argument for what he brings to the table.

Personally, I wish we had seen more of McShane and he'd been given a number of games in a row to build some form and consistency. I do think he has potential and offers quite a lot.

On your last point about Farrell, firstly I think he has been a success having claimed an England jersey at a young age, and looked one of the better players. However, good as he may be, England winning honours is hampered by many other things such as other team, the rest of his team mates, style of play etc. If England don't win another title for the duration of his career that doesn't make him a failure