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| Quote ="G1"It's a dilemma.
Smith hasn't had the best of seasons but is solid and a proven big game player. Donald is the fastest and I think Wembley would suit him to a tee.
With the front row absences I might change my stance on Eastwood and use him as interchange prop. With this in mind there may be room for Delaney or keith in the 2nd row, giving freedom to select both Smith and Donald.'"
Kirke and Ali could just as easily fill in as interchange prop.
However Eastwood better games was away at Wire as prop, so who knows!!
Then there's Ambler in the mix......who is a prop who wouldn't let anyone down.
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| I'm with G1 we will need to utilise a second row as prop and smith in the centre spot
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| Quote ="G1"It's a dilemma.
Smith hasn't had the best of seasons but is solid and a proven big game player. Donald is the fastest and I think Wembley would suit him to a tee.
With the front row absences I might change my stance on Eastwood and use him as interchange prop. With this in mind there may be room for Delaney or keith in the 2nd row, giving freedom to select both Smith and Donald.'"
With respect, the Challenge Cup Final is not the time or the place to be experimenting with centres in the second row. I understand that Delaney has played for the Titans in the back row before but the contest between the forwards is going to be hard enough without having threequarters defending down the middle.
I'd also prefer to have size in the centres to counter Atkins and King.
We are blessed with two good wingmen in Donald and Smith. It's Bluey's call and I appreciate it's a tough one but that's what he gets paid for. Personally, I'm not a fan of making radical changes to the squad so that we can accommodate 3 wingers in the starting 13.
Donald or Smith will be disappointed but at least we'll have a quick water carrier.
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| Quote ="kirkstaller"
We are blessed with two good wingers in Donald and Smith. It's Bluey's call and I appreciate it's a tough one but that's what he gets paid for. Personally, I'm not a fan of making radical changes to the squad so that we can accommodate 3 wingers in the starting 13.
'" It wouldn't be radical. We've been accomadating all 3 in the 17 for much of the season
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| Quote ="G1"It wouldn't be radical. We've been accomadating all 3 in the 17 for much of the season'"
I appreciate that, but the way injuries and suspensions have worked out it's only been an issue for the last two games.
Delaney and Senior have to my knowledge not yet started in the second row this season.
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| Quote ="kirkstaller"
Delaney and Senior have to my knowledge not yet started in the second row this season.'" They may not have been named there on the team sheets but, particularly in the semi final, Senior was so far infield he was almost playing front row!
Our players are versatile and there's very little difference between centre and 2nd row these days. Senior has also played a lot of rugby there in his early Sheffield career.
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| Quote ="G1"They may not have been named there on the team sheets but, particularly in the semi final, Senior was so far infield he was almost playing front row!
Our players are versatile and there's very little difference between centre and 2nd row these days. Senior has also played a lot of rugby there in his early Sheffield career.'"
Would this result in one of JJB/Ablett/Clarkson missing out?
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| Donald would be my choice.
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| I think the team will look something like this:
Brent Webb
Ryan Hall
Keith Senior
Brett Delaney
Lee Smith
Danny McGuire
Rob Burrow
Kylie Leuleui
Danny Buderus
Ryan Bailey
Jamie Jones-Buchanan
Carl Ablett
Kevin Sinfield
Matt Diskin
Ian Kirke/Clarkson/Lauititi/Eastwood
I think that Bluey is likely to choose Smith given that he got the nod for the game against Saints.
The last 3 bench spots are where Bluey has truly difficult decisions to make. Keep the young kid who has let no one down, or roll with your mate from NZ? Choose Kirke the plodder (I mean this in a nice way) or gamble with Lauititi's explosiveness?
I do have a feeling that Bluey will select the big names and have Clarkson experience Wembley as the 18th man. Not necessarily the correct decision but I just have a feeling it will happen.
Who'd be a coach?
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| Smith has to play - look at his record in grand finals (4 tries in 3) - and for me Clarkson would be one of the first picked in the starting line-up. He's been sensational in recent weeks.
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| Quote ="kirkstaller"Would this result in one of JJB/Ablett/Clarkson missing out?'"
It would so you've convinced me, for that reason, it's not on. Straight choice between Donald and Smith and it's a decision I can't make. I feel Wembley and those spaces are made for him (but how many chances will he get outside Delaney anyway) but Smith is a big game player and better under the high ball. As you say, who would be a coach.
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| If we had Peacock I'd be tempted to start with Donald and have Smith on the bench as cover for 1-5 and an 'X' factor if required. Without Peacock's graft I don't think we can afford that luxury and have to have 4 forwards on the bench. Peacock's absence makes even more important picking a grafter like Clarkson either starting or on the bench.
I've been watching Leeds for a long time, and this is probably the most 'luxury' I can remember in terms of wing options.
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| Quote ="BrisbaneRhino"If we had Peacock I'd be tempted to start with Donald and have Smith on the bench as cover for 1-5 and an 'X' factor if required. Without Peacock's graft I don't think we can afford that luxury and have to have 4 forwards on the bench. Peacock's absence makes even more important picking a grafter like Clarkson either starting or on the bench.
I've been watching Leeds for a long time, and this is probably the most 'luxury' I can remember in terms of wing options.'"
At last somebody that agrees with me Smith on the bench. (Donald on the left wing with Senior).
We then need it filling with three BIG game changing forwards two of which should be Ali and Eastwood. That of course means, unfortunately, no place for Diskin who only succeeds in stopping our go forward momentum when on as an interchange.
Clarkson should start and probably play the full 80 as our main grafter if possible.
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| If you read my post I said I'd have Smith on the bench IF we had Peacock - without him IMO a threequarter on the bench is a luxury we can't afford.
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| Wonder if the case for Donald may change now..............
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Wonder if the case for Donald may change now..............
'"
You would hope that Donald's retirement does not become a factor in what ever choice McCLennan makes
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Wonder if the case for Donald may change now..............
'"
Not for me bud Smithy it is!
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| I'd go for Donald, simply because at Wembley, he will have the space and he does have the speed to trouble Wire. It'll be his last chance at a cup medal, and I suspect that the thought of finishing his career on a high will be sufficent motivation for him to stretch his legs. And for me at least, he owes us a big performance. Despite missing around half the season with injuries, he was offered an extended contract, which he now looks unlikely to fulfill. A repeat of 07 will do nicely!
Smithy may feel a tad annoyed, possibley with some justification when he thinks about previous Final performances, but sometimes coaches look for consistency in a player, rather than someone who only really produces once a year.
A tough call either way for Bluey
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| Quote ="thebloodbath"Wonder if the case for Donald may change now..............
'"
I'd hope this would have no bearing on it, although it would be a shame for Scott to miss out if this is his last season. The final line-up in the backs will be a real headache for McClennan.
Webb must be a cert - too much of an influential play-maker.
Smith has shown in the past that he is capable of rising to the occasion, and has played in GFs at FB, wing and centre. He is the sort of player that could make things happen from the bench if he slotted in at FB, but with Peacock missing I think we will need four forwards on the bench so this isn't probably a good idea.
Hall is too much of a clinical finisher to be left out - and his ability to take pressure off the forwards is important.
Donald hasn't shown much form when I've seen him so far this year, although as others have suggested the wide open spaces at Wembley could suit his game.
Senior has all the experience and is in good form, although his defence has been questioned lately.
Delaney is more of a big unit than Smith at centre, and seems sound defensively when he concentrates. I think he's received some unfair stick from some posters on here. Playing him in the back row would be a poor option given that we have more than enough talent there already.
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| Quote ="G1"It would so you've convinced me, for that reason, it's not on. Straight choice between Donald and Smith and it's a decision I can't make. I feel Wembley and those spaces are made for him (but how many chances will he get outside Delaney anyway) but Smith is a big game player and better under the high ball. As you say, who would be a coach.'"
Agreed, it is a difficult one. Although I am leaning towards Scott at the mo - not just because of his announcement.
Smith will always offer the unexpected, but at the end of the day we had prepared for this seas on without him so he couldn't really complain if he were to be left out.
Scott will offer us pure pace - which no one else can. The challenge cup final at Wembley (as history has proven) really suits speedsters (Offiah, Robinson ......even Leroy!)
Then again, Smiths record in finals is outstanding, can we overlook that?
Maybe Smithy on the bench would work, do we really need 4 forwards? Buderus, JJB, Ablett, Clarkson & Sinny are more than capable of 80 mins - plus there's Senior or Delaney who could do a stint up front.
Over to you Bluey, do us proud
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| If you are looking at it from a pace point of view, you look at Warrington with Riley and Hicks on the wings would you rather we had Donald and Hall against them or Smith and Hall.....
Donald offers pace to match Riley in a foot race where Smith doesnt. Hall is the match for Hicks if not slightly quicker perhaps.....
As has been said, in the open spaces of Wembley pure pace could be a huge asset.
If its King they play on the wing outside Atkins then Smith v King might be a more even match pace wise....
Its a really difficult decision and not one I'd like to make!
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| Quote ="BrisbaneRhino"If you read my post I said I'd have Smith on the bench IF we had Peacock - without him IMO a threequarter on the bench is a luxury we can't afford.'"
Why ? As others have pointed out Delaney and Senior offer extra cover for the forwards if necessary !!!
Let's not take ourselves too seriously though ....we have no influence and whatever team is selected I will be cheering on regardless
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| Without JP against Warrington's big pack we cannot afford a back on the bench IMO. We will need all the go forward we can get from 4 big fellas on the bench to make up for JP's loss otherwise the backs won't get decent ball. Crucial area
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| I don't see Coach McClennan deviating from his back selection for the semi-final assuming the same names are all available.
Is Wembley any wider than the Galpharm?
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| Quote ="Juan Cornetto"Without JP against Warrington's big pack we cannot afford a back on the bench IMO. We will need all the go forward we can get from 4 big fellas on the bench to make up for JP's loss otherwise the backs won't get decent ball. Crucial area'"
We lost JP in the opening minutes of our league game against Warrington at Headingley. How was the bench made up that day?
I've said it before but the key to overcoming Warrington's pack lies on the end of Sinfield's boot.
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