The people who keep banging the drum for a peoples vote are too embarressed to call it a referendum, as it was promised before the last one that we will not have another referendum if we vote to leave.

I agree there’s no reason why something can’t be sorted out, once a trade agreement with the EU is agreed or as part of it. The backstop is a ‘what if’ insurance policy in case, for some reason, a deal isn’t reached. It is including a condition for the future relationship negotiations within the divorce deal. Now, there’s an entirely coherent argument that the two should be independent, and this should be for discussion at the next stage. However, if we have red lines it isn’t unreasonable for the EU to have some too and Ireland got out in front of this, whereas I suspect much of GB half-forgot about NI once the bombings and shootings ceased being a near daily staple on the news.

The EU won’t want an unsupervised backdoor. If stuff can be routed through NI, into Ireland and then potentially into mainland Europe, without any EU checks, and there are differences in tariffs that make it worthwhile, then opportunistic/unscrupulous traders will take advantage of that.

Quote ="Mild Rover"I’m not in favour of a second referendum and I couldn’t agree more about trying to pass off a ‘people’s vote’ as something different. That attempted re-labelling is some more feeble-minded wazzockry. However, I do think this quote bears endless repeating: ‘In a 52-48 referendum, this would be unfinished business by a long way’ N. Farage MEP. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics- ... m-36306681 Fair play to David Cameron on ‘neverendum’, as well.'" If remain would have won the vote, not only would Farage be calling for another Referendum the whole of UKIP would have been the same, that's the whole point of their existence as is the SNP as soon as they lost the last one they started to plan and push for the next, they will pick their time and push for another independence referendum. Following the vote pundits were asking what is the point of UKIP now. By the way love the word "Wazzockry"

Quote ="Mild Rover"I’m not in favour of a second referendum and I couldn’t agree more about trying to pass off a ‘people’s vote’ as something different. That attempted re-labelling is some more feeble-minded wazzockry. However, I do think this quote bears endless repeating: ‘In a 52-48 referendum, this would be unfinished business by a long way’ N. Farage MEP. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics- ... m-36306681 Fair play to David Cameron on ‘neverendum’, as well.'" If remain would have won the vote, not only would Farage be calling for another Referendum the whole of UKIP would have been the same, that's the whole point of their existence as is the SNP as soon as they lost the last one they started to plan and push for the next, they will pick their time and push for another independence referendum. Following the vote pundits were asking what is the point of UKIP now. By the way love the word "Wazzockry"

People voted (regardless of number), and they voted to leave, it really us as simple as that.

May doesn't want to so is making it almost impossible, I am a conservative, she is a gravy train rider, spending my taxes on stupid ideas like HS2.

I personally believe that she was a fake remainer pre referendum purely because she thought she was backing the winning side, and that she in fact does want to leave.

The fact that both quitlings and remainers think she's supporting the other side is testament to how dreadful she is as Prime Minister.

Except it isn't - the Leave campaign has slowly but surely been revealed as criminal - with Aaron Banks and Nigel Farage now 'persons of interest' in an FBI investigation; our democracy has been subverted, but very few people seem to care, because they think they 'won' something.

No most of us don't care because we've got a brain we can think for ourselves and we wanted to leave the EU end of get over it, We didn't think we won mate we did. Farage wasn't even part of the official leave campaign, he couldn't even win his seat in the election and yet he convinced over 17 million people to vote leave

Our democracy has not been subverted at all, even though the government spent millions of OUR money giving us one side why we should vote remain, both sides repeatedly told us that we would have to leave the single market and the customs union, the then chancellor told us lies. But the majority of the country still voted leave.

Your just trying to wind me up, you must be

Hadn't you realised that although its only one island, there are 2 seperate countries, ruled by seperate governments and the only reason that free trade currently exists (without a hard border) is because both of these countries are part of the EU.
There are those in the North that believe that Ireland should be one nation but, you will have to encourage more people to sign up for Sinn Fein if you want to see a united Ireland and whilst it remains as 2 nations and assuming there isn't a free trade agreement post Brexit, there will need to be some way of cross border checks.
Northern Ireland is part of the UK, Eire isn't.
It's not so long ago that there was a hard border between the 2 sides with armed soldiers at the check points.
On of the major plus points of EU membership + the good Friday agreement is that these were no longer required.

Ireland is the only place where the UK has a physical border with the EU and things could get pretty messy post Brexit.
It will instantly become a smugglers paradise with people on both sides trying to avoid certain taxes and levies with trade between the UK and Europe and should there be a return to a hard border, we may well see the return of sectarian violence, which has never fully disappeared.

It is a very complex issue I agree and something I never gave a thought to, but I am sure there is a solution that would suit all sides. I was watching a tv prog last night and there is already salmon poaching and illegal deer hunting on what they called the border lands I dread to think what will happen if nothing is sorted

Why would the FBI be interested?

The Referendum Act of 2015 required that the government report to the people of this country on 3 things:

1. The outcome of the negotiations with the EU.
2. The opinion of the Government on the outcome of the negotiations.
3. Information about membership of the European Union (obligations and rights etc).

Which they did via the leaflet. Part 2 clearly states that they were required to inform the UK of the government position, NOT to set out both arguments for and against.

Dont pi$$ on his chips by offering facts, let him stay in dreamland

I tell you something that aggravates me greatly, is the revisionist mantra that "both sides told lies". To me this is a bit like saying both a rubber dinghy and an oil tanker are boats. Yes I suppose they are, but the order of magnitude renders the comparison absurd.

Even on Sunday we had a government Minister Esther Mcvey tweeting that we'd have to join the EURO after 2020 if we stayed. A flat out lie that then spreads around the leave demographic as if it were fact.

Which she doubled down on today after a massive backlash, saying, in essence, "that tweet I did may have been a lie, but I'm sure we can all agree that it would be awful if it were true; true or false?!"

These people are sociopaths - the extent of the dishonesty, disinformation, rhetoric and outright lies is astonishing; and each time that the angry gammon masses lap it up, they seem further emboldened.

I don't recall our politics being in such a parlous state in my lifetime - and it could get worse tomorrow if Mrs May decides to pull the now meaningless meaningful vote.

Ok, I don't know if what you are saying is correct but I have absolutely no reason to doubt it, however, do you honestly believe that in this current climate that spending nearly £10 million of tax payers money on sending a leaflet to each and every person was money well spent and that it couldn't have been done in a more cost effective way.

Which is ?

Quote ="POSTL"Ok, I don't know if what you are saying is correct but I have absolutely no reason to doubt it, however, do you honestly believe that in this current climate that spending nearly £10 million of tax payers money on sending a leaflet to each and every person was money well spent and that it couldn't have been done in a more cost effective way.'" £4.2 BILLION quid allocated to prepare for Brexit so far. Source - https://fullfact.org/europe/whats-cost- ... ng-brexit/ That could've been spent on long suffering public services.

Quote ="POSTL"Ok, I don't know if what you are saying is correct but I have absolutely no reason to doubt it, however, do you honestly believe that in this current climate that spending nearly £10 million of tax payers money on sending a leaflet to each and every person was money well spent and that it couldn't have been done in a more cost effective way.'" £4.2 BILLION quid allocated to prepare for Brexit so far. Source - https://fullfact.org/europe/whats-cost- ... ng-brexit/ That could've been spent on long suffering public services.

I ask again, why would the FBI be interested?

Quote ="Bullseye"£4.2 BILLION quid allocated to prepare for Brexit so far. Source - https://fullfact.org/europe/whats-cost- ... ng-brexit/ That could've been spent on long suffering public services.'" Agreed, So we need to get on with it then leave the EU and stop spending stupid money.

Quote ="Bullseye"£4.2 BILLION quid allocated to prepare for Brexit so far. Source - https://fullfact.org/europe/whats-cost- ... ng-brexit/ That could've been spent on long suffering public services.'" Agreed, So we need to get on with it then leave the EU and stop spending stupid money.

I mistyped - it's actually the [url=https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6345687/How-Britains-FBI-probe-Arron-Banks-links-Moscow.htmlthe British equivalent,[/url the NCA.

We could just get on with it and leave with no deal in a few days I suppose. Indeed, at Government Departments across the land, people working in key areas that you would probably regard as being utterly vital are being hauled off to emergency plan the ruinous impact of no deal. Your taxes are being used to pervert the day job of the civil service from furthering the health and wellbeing of the nation, to trying to desperately mitigate the catastrophic impact.

The thing is it isn't stupid money. If we're going to do this it will cost billions. To not prepare would be stupid. It's incredibly complicated. To rush it is madness.

Perhaps this figure of 4 BILLION QUID just to prepare should've gone on the side of the bus. I don't think it was a vote winner though.

All spent and we haven't even left yet!

May has also awarded a multi million pound contract to a ferry company that's actually not got any ferries, The government has also just paid the euro tunnel company 33 million in an out of court settlement because of a tendering mess.

All this money has been spent and what is even worse we won't even leave without a deal what a waste.

I'll be glad when it's all put to bed, then we can move on to the next referendum, hopefully one on Capital Punishment.

The fifty two percent for Brexit would be eclipsed by a yes vote, would they dare do it, of course not, yet this Tory spat continues to fracture the whole nation.

Nope we won't do that unless the EU refuses to let us extend article 50 that is. which they won't