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| Quote ="cod'ead"It's speaks volumes of just how "in-touch" Beecroft is if he thinks Cable is a socialist'"
It speaks volumes for just how far elements of the Conservative Party is moving to the right that this sort of thing sees the light of day. |
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More from the "you couldn't make it up" department.
[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/may/22/jobseekers-alcohol-drug-addiction-benefits-cutIan Duncan Smith to announce benefit cuts for claimants who refuse drug or alcohol treatments[/url
He can spot an expert miles away can this bloke. Not content with Atos making disability diagnoses via a checklist, he's now proposing that Jobcentre+ staff will be able to tell if a claimant has a drug or alcohol problem and if those "suspected" of being an addict refuse treatment, they can authorise a cut in benefits. All this while dependency treatment centres are seeing their budgets slashed or are closed alltogether
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| Quote ="cod'ead"More from the "you couldn't make it up" department.
[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/may/22/jobseekers-alcohol-drug-addiction-benefits-cutIan Duncan Smith to announce benefit cuts for claimants who refuse drug or alcohol treatments[/url
He can spot an expert miles away can this bloke. Not content with Atos making disability diagnoses via a checklist, he's now proposing that Jobcentre+ staff will be able to tell if a claimant has a drug or alcohol problem and if those "suspected" of being an addict refuse treatment, they can authorise a cut in benefits. All this while dependency treatment centres are seeing their budgets slashed or are closed alltogether'"
[iUnemployed people suspected of suffering from alcoholism or drug addiction will have their benefits cut if they refuse treatment for their condition[/i
Suspected ?
You only have to suspect someone of drug or alcohol dependency in order to cut their benefits ?
Does the fool understand the nature of alcoholism ?
Does he acknowledge that theres a fighting chance that some of the job centre counter staff will themselves be alcoholics and yet none of their work mates will suspect a thing and won't have done for years, does he really believe that its easy to spot an alcoholic because they all slur their words and dress like they've just slept in a hedge ?
Does he really think that he is in touch with reality or is he just absolutely desperate now to cut something else, anything else ? |
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[url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/2012/may/29/benefits-system-fit-for-work?CMP=twt_guYet another example of a typical, feckless wastrel claiming benefits[/url
I just don't know what we'll end up doing with these people. Is this really the "Big Society"
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An absolute disgrace. I await the apologists for this government coming on to explain why this is even remotely acceptable in a supposedly civilised society.
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| Quote ="Mintball"An absolute disgrace. I await the apologists for this government coming on to explain why this is even remotely acceptable in a supposedly civilised society.'"
What's new? You and others have mocked my absolute hatred of local Authority Officers involved with the care and education of disabled kids because they lie and cheat and in their case flagrantly break the law of the land and often put kids at risk. It's just an extension of the same thing.
I suppose we need to re-engineer the welfare system so that funds are readily avaiable to help the disabled. The easiest way of doing that would be to put back the retirement and state pension age to say 83. The problem is that people campaign against increasing the retirement age, quite why I have no idea. The reason I use 83 is that would be today's equivalent of the 1945/6 male retirement age, when the system came into being. |
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No. People 'mock' you for being - on the basis of your own reports - a really rude and uncivilised oik. And generally they think that, on the basis of what we've seen here, anyone dealing with you, whether in the public or private sectors, would have to be an absolute saint.
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| Quote ="Dally"What's new? You and others have mocked my absolute hatred of local Authority Officers involved with the care and education of disabled kids because they lie and cheat and in their case flagrantly break the law of the land and often put kids at risk. It's just an extension of the same thing.
I suppose we need to re-engineer the welfare system so that funds are readily avaiable to help the disabled. The easiest way of doing that would be to put back the retirement and state pension age to say 83. The problem is that people campaign against increasing the retirement age, quite why I have no idea. The reason I use 83 is that would be today's equivalent of the 1945/6 male retirement age, when the system came into being.'"
An easier way would be to maximise the tax-take from those who are better positioned to afford it. |
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[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9298663/Benefits-spending-blows-out-by-9bn.htmlLooks like the benefit cuts are working then[/url
Errrrrrrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmm apart from the fact that we'll be spending £9bn more than predicted
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| Quote ="cod'ead"[url=http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9298663/Benefits-spending-blows-out-by-9bn.htmlLooks like the benefit cuts are working then[/url
Errrrrrrrrrrmmmmmmmmmmm apart from the fact that we'll be spending £9bn more than predicted'"
This was predicted by disabled people well over a year ago when it became obvious just how many people were "failing" the Atos medical and appealing and then going to tribunerals and winning. But the government do not listen to us. Yes, test us by all means, but to really save the money, test us fairly and squarly without trying to "cheat" us to get us off the benefit, it also doesn't help when a private company (Atos) are getting a big enough kick back for every person found "fit for work", it all adds up. It would have been cheaper and less complicated for the DWP to be doing the testing.
As for Coddys other link, a really, really sad state of affairs, one which I read about every single day around the t'internet. I see more than most because I belong to groups that share experiences and I could spend a whole day just posting stories on here that you wouldn't believe.
Anyway, more money wasted for the government today....I am off to the hospital now as I have got much worse over the past 9 months (we think with all the stress of having my benefit removed this September) and I have to plead my case to the Rheumatologist to ask him nicely if he will kindly write me a report stating how much worse I am since I last saw him 8 months ago, so I can send it off to the very sympathetic (!) people at Atos! I shouldn't be doing this kind of work for them but there you are. |
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www.dailymail.co.uk/health/artic ... lower.html
Interesting article from the other side of the desk at Atos Assesments. Only confirms what disabled people who are called in for appointments knew already; its nothing to do with genuinly assessing disabled people but more about keeping the Government happy.
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www.dailymail.co.uk/health/artic ... lower.html
Interesting article from the other side of the desk at Atos Assesments. Only confirms what disabled people who are called in for appointments knew already; its nothing to do with genuinly assessing disabled people but more about keeping the Government happy.
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| Quote ="Hull White Star"www.dailymail.co.uk/health/article-1021686/How-doctors-like-punished-exposing-sicknote-scroungers-whistleblower.html
Interesting article from the other side of the desk at Atos Assesments. Only confirms what disabled people who are called in for appointments knew already; its nothing to do with genuinly assessing disabled people but more about keeping the Government happy.'"
I must confess to being confused by that report. Till i read that, the picture I had was that Atos was telling everyone they were fit for work, and that was the raison d'etre. But this guy is saying precisely the opposite. What's going on?
Also how is it cheaper to pay him £200,000+ pa., ON TOP OF the huge amounts undoubtedly made by Atos (or else why are they doing it) than to employ in-house doctors to do the assessments?
(" If I worked hard, I could earn £4,500 a week."icon_wink.gif
An article that raises many questions. |
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| Quote ="Ferocious Aardvark"I must confess to being confused by that report. Till i read that, the picture I had was that Atos was telling everyone they were fit for work, and that was the raison d'etre. But this guy is saying precisely the opposite. What's going on?
Also how is it cheaper to pay him £200,000+ pa., ON TOP OF the huge amounts undoubtedly made by Atos (or else why are they doing it) than to employ in-house doctors to do the assessments?
(" If I worked hard, I could earn £4,500 a week."icon_wink.gif
An article that raises many questions.'"
If you read the article closely you will see he is refering to his time at ATOS in 2005 - 7 years ago!! The Work Capability Assesment has changed beyond recognition since the Tories came in. They have made the WCA virtually impossible to "pass" and a lot of people (75%) are "failing" and scoring 0-14 points (15 being needed to get the benefit). Doctor Branton is also referring to assesing people for Incapacity Benefit, a benefit which no longer exists and hasn't since 2008. New benefit and assesment rules have been brought in with the new ESA post 2008, so while I have no doubt what he is saying is true for 2005, it is not a true picture for the present. The ordinary man however, on the street will not have a clue between the difference in sickness benefits in 2005 and 2012!
I also question why the article is in the DM - a paper that has so vehmently tries to discredit ESA claimants on an almost daily basis. The more cynical part of me knows damn well why this article is in the DM. |
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www.dwp.gov.uk/newsroom/minister ... 5-12.shtml
Chris Graylings speech today:
[iWhat has happened is the mix of people coming through the incapacity benefit reassessment is different to what we expected. We have more people fit for work, and moving to JSA. We have more people needing long term unconditional support than expected. And those in the middle group, who would expect before too long to be mandated to the Work Programme, have proved to be sicker and further from the workplace than we expected. So it will take far more time than we predicted for them to be ready to make a return to work. [/i
I think you'll find Mr Grayling that we told you so, but you are so arrogant you wouldn't listen. Labour Lords tried to get you to rethink the one year ESA rule as it was too short for people to "get better", but you wouldn't listen. We have always said there are people who needed more support than they got, but you wouldn't listen. I'm no Mystic Meg, but these were the very things disabled people and Labour Peers tried to tell you during the WRB consultation with your mate Lord Freud, but you didn't listen. Are you now going to listen?
And that wonderful piece:
[iWe simply cannot afford to have people languishing on benefits. [/i
At least I know where I stand now with this government. I haven't been ill for the past 14 years, I have been langushing on benefits. When I'm struggling on with my disability, I'll bear in mind that I'm just languishing. And theres me thinking that I have paid my taxes and was going to get the support in my time of need. Well I was right for 12 years, the last two I've had the rug pulled from under me.
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www.dwp.gov.uk/newsroom/minister ... 5-12.shtml
Chris Graylings speech today:
[iWhat has happened is the mix of people coming through the incapacity benefit reassessment is different to what we expected. We have more people fit for work, and moving to JSA. We have more people needing long term unconditional support than expected. And those in the middle group, who would expect before too long to be mandated to the Work Programme, have proved to be sicker and further from the workplace than we expected. So it will take far more time than we predicted for them to be ready to make a return to work. [/i
I think you'll find Mr Grayling that we told you so, but you are so arrogant you wouldn't listen. Labour Lords tried to get you to rethink the one year ESA rule as it was too short for people to "get better", but you wouldn't listen. We have always said there are people who needed more support than they got, but you wouldn't listen. I'm no Mystic Meg, but these were the very things disabled people and Labour Peers tried to tell you during the WRB consultation with your mate Lord Freud, but you didn't listen. Are you now going to listen?
And that wonderful piece:
[iWe simply cannot afford to have people languishing on benefits. [/i
At least I know where I stand now with this government. I haven't been ill for the past 14 years, I have been langushing on benefits. When I'm struggling on with my disability, I'll bear in mind that I'm just languishing. And theres me thinking that I have paid my taxes and was going to get the support in my time of need. Well I was right for 12 years, the last two I've had the rug pulled from under me.
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It's all the Tories fault. If Labour were in office you would be entilted to £1M per week, live in a big mansion with a swimming pool and have 10 butlers to wait on your every need. This is a fact.
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| Quote ="Ajw71"It's all the Tories fault. If Labour were in office you would be entilted to £1M per week, live in a big mansion with a swimming pool and have 10 butlers to wait on your every need. This is a fact.'"
So, did you miss the point because you're stupid or because you're just thick? |
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| Quote ="Ajw71"It's all the Tories fault. If Labour were in office you would be entilted to £1M per week, live in a big mansion with a swimming pool and have 10 butlers to wait on your every need. This is a fact.'"
No mate, if Labour were in power I wouldn't have my £94 a week and self worth taken away from me, and that is fact. 94 quid a week may not seem a lot and it isn't but to me its my independence, my contribution to the household, so I don't have to "ask" for pocket money. I didn't ask to have my disability nor did I give up my job in accounts to scrounge 94 quid a week and watch Jeremy Kyle all day.
Come back when you've something decent to contribute. |
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| Quote ="Mintball"So, did you miss the point because you're stupid or because you're just thick?'"
What is the point your Intellectual Eminence? Are you suggesting that the disabled were treated fairly and in accordance with the law under Labour? I can assure you that was not the case, at least for children, during that era. |
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| Quote ="Dally"What is the point your Intellectual Eminence? Are you suggesting that the disabled were treated fairly and in accordance with the law under Labour? I can assure you that was not the case, at least for children, during that era.'"
Can't speak for children but as a disabled adult I was treated fairly under Labour. I got just enough IB & IS to keep me afloat and keep my mortgate payments up until I was able to return to work which I did. I then got progressivly worse and again in 2004 when I had no choice but to either spend 5 days a week in hospital or give up my job I was treated fairly. I had enough medical evidence to get DLA and IB. Now under the Tories I have been given one year to get better - to say they have no idea is an understatement! As from September I have to join the job centre queues (in my wheelchair because I can't stand for long periods) but actually I can't because I can't legally say I can work 40 hours a week.
If you believe we are being treated the same under the Tories as Labour then you are very much mistaken, or very naive. |
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| Such was the blatancy of local authority's (and still is) a charity even produced tea-towels:
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| Quote ="Ajw71"It's all the Tories fault. If Labour were in office you would be entilted to £1M per week, live in a big mansion with a swimming pool and have 10 butlers to wait on your every need. This is a fact.'"
Quote ="Dally"What is the point your Intellectual Eminence? Are you suggesting that the disabled were treated fairly and in accordance with the law under Labour? I can assure you that was not the case, at least for children, during that era.'"
Do you both think I sit here I make things up for the sake of it??? Of course whats happening is this governments fault, they are the ones who made the rules on the Welfare Reform Bill, not Labour. All I ask for is to be treated fairly, just like I have been since 1998 when I was diagnosed. I'm not lying, I'm not exaggerating, I try and link articles when and where possible because there are many, many people who think like you two, either have no idea what is happening, can't believe what is happening or don't really care about what is happening because it doesn't affect them.
Everyone is just a hearbeat away from becoming sick and disabled and you are the sort of people who would be the first ones raising the roof if this was happening to you, as I know you are capable of Dally with hospitals you have encounted.
Yes, this is really happening to the sick and disabled. Men in comas are being found fit for work, disabled people from birth are given one year to "get better" then having to join the dole queue and disabled people are being told to get a proper job (a la IDS referring to Remploy workers) and all in the name of saving money from this callous, nasty government.
The sooner this shower "do a u-turn" right out of Number 10 the better. |
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| Quote ="Hull White Star"Do you both think I sit here I make things up for the sake of it??? '"
Of course not. But all governments are poor in this country in this regard.
One think I've noticed in my lifetime is that in times of high unemployment claimants are branded scroungers and there are moves to cut benefits whereas in times of 'full' employment the real scroungers are given good benefits. It ironic. (NB I am not talking of the sick / disabled here). |
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| Quote ="Dally"Of course not. But all governments are poor in this country in this regard.
One think I've noticed in my lifetime is that in times of high unemployment claimants are branded scroungers and there are moves to cut benefits whereas in times of 'full' employment the real scroungers are given good benefits. It ironic. (NB I am not talking of the sick / disabled here).'"
Its only the press that call benefit claimants scroungers. They whip the public up into such a frenzy. I have been claiming benefits for my illness for many years - DLA is not an out of work benefit, and I never heard a murmour about being a scrounger or "shop a cheat" campaigns nor do I recall Labour ministers telling twitter/facebook users if they have a disabled friend who used social networking to shop them as they can work like Tory [url=http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2010/oct/01/twitter-benefit-cheat-nadine-dorriesNadine Dorries[/url disgustingly did. |
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And the latest from Porky Pickles?
[url=http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ios-exclusive-problem-families-told--stop-blaming-others-7834235.htmlProblem families told "stop blaming others"[/url
I wonder if he can make a start on some of the problem families closer to his heart, who continue to blame others for their situation? The Osbornes and Camorons spring readily to mind.
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| Quote ="cod'ead"And the latest from Porky Pickles?
[url=http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/ios-exclusive-problem-families-told--stop-blaming-others-7834235.htmlProblem families told "stop blaming others"[/url
I wonder if he can make a start on some of the problem families closer to his heart, who continue to blame others for their situation? The Osbornes and Camorons spring readily to mind.'"
They couldn't possibly do that. The entire strategy of this government (that everything that goes wrong is someone else's fault) would be in tatters. |
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