The question was posed, "What happened before the internet". It occurred to me the claim 'There is no way a jetliner could bring down a building as massive as a Trade Centre' is a statement on a par with "there is no way a spark from a bakers oven could burn down all London".

But then it ocurred to me that if the Great fire of London happened today, then of course it would 100% definitely be a false flag fire, no way could one spark do that, there were incendiary devices fitted all round the capital, and all the rest. In fact, I doubt any major disaster in all of recorded history would be conspiracy proof. Sad, really. But when people are willing to engage in serious conversation with a man who believes the Earth is flat, then gullibility knows no bounds.

"Uncovering the Schitzoid" You are a deeply weird man. I'm sure because you have no real answer to my questions you have used the foe button and hid away like a coward. If not, lets respond to your latest weirdo Wolfgang. If anyone can quote this, so the idiot can see it would be appreciated. Now onto old Wolfgang.

Did you know that despite how certain he was Sandy Hook was a hoax. He dropped his Lawsuit against Newtown before he got to court, this after being told he had, and could not provide any conclusive proof. He was given an opportunity to present this in court, and declined, withdrawing his lawsuit. How Weird!

Mr Halbig openly lies in his Video, he is not, and never has been a state trooper for a long period. He was actually sacked after his first year, he then attempted to become a Football coach and failed at this also. Mr Halbig, has a number of failed legal claims on his record, all of which he had no concrete evidence.

Mr Halbig, initially made 2 attempts to complain against Newtown. The first was thrown out entirely, the 2nd Was almost completely dismissed only stating that Newtown had been slightly late in their response.

Mr Halbig's Liar, erm sorry Lawyer. Then attempted to present a picture of the Sandy Hook choir singing at the Super Bowl imposed on a legal document. It was proven, in court, that this piece of evidence was clearly not authentic. In court his Lawyer folded the document in an attempt to hide the fact that his was not authentic. Not content with failing Miserably in his first attempts, Mr Halbig then appealed to the superior court, he was also told there, there was no case to answer.

What Mr Halbig actually is doing, is a Nationwide tour, speaking to impressionable crackpots, and making money off them. The Man continues to harass Parents who have lost their children despite continually losing at every turn. He is a sick, greedy, liar.

P.S You are aware that Mr Halbig then disappeared? Withdraw himself from a Sandy Hook "The Truth" Group. Took himself off Facebook, and removed his Sandy Hook the truth Facebook page. Weirdly, he had received $20,000-30,000 from the public to help his "Truth Campaign" Just before disappearing. Wow.

Believes the Earth is flat?! Wow.

Gee Whizz this is getting obsessively odd and worrying behaviour by JML32 also known as The Butcher. I've know idea what the damaged schizoid has posted due to the gracious option of the Foe button, but his continued tailgating of someone whom he regards as a weirdo i find this behaviour uncomfortable an kind of weirder than weird

Conspiracy theorists are difficult to engage with when they take on the condescending, wall of noise superiority of Flat Stanley; a constant barrage of self-affirming nonsense lauded as 'proof' that they are right, together with a tendency to deride people as 'sheep' if they aren't instantly convinced - it's not a very inclusive presentation style and suggests more than a hint of anxiety and emotional distress. That perception is amplified if the theorist in question believes every conspiracy that's available to them - that suggests the opposite of what they would have you believe; that they have diligently researched the issue and come to a logical conclusion. Rather, it suggests that they're cynical to begin with, suspicious of authority/politics/religion - whatever - and will simply adopt any theory that paints those bodies in a negative light; it's called a monological belief system.

Personally, I'm certain that throughout human history, there have been events that power-brokers have engineered specifically to create a certain set of circumstances; I'm happy to hear other people's thoughts on that and to do my own reading around it. I'm certainly not happy though, to believe that every single event that has any sense of uncertainty attached to it is based on the covert actions of a government, military or corporate entity - that way lies madness, as this thread clearly demonstrates.

Fair comment you're entitled to your own opinion as i am mine, and my beliefs are based on lengthy hours of looking through both ends of the spectrum which lead on to a great awakening investigating 9/11, which lead to researching secret societies amongst many many other false flagged events. I'd wager your's are based upon the mainstream hypnotist. Once you've read and reviewed archive footage and researched certain events i'm afraid the Rabbit hole just gets deeper and deeper. Like Mugwump said i could provide a mountain of high court evidence and it'd still fall on deaf ears. You'd continue to raise the bar. The bull i derive got you intrigued enough to reply. Please tell me what you know about Paris Terrorism come on i'm so intrigued to know.?



Typical house bringing up the earths shape,You remind me of the typical big gob coward goading and antagonising at the rear of the crowd. If you keep on prodding that stick i'll spam your ficticious thread to bits with a barrage of NASA bull, so i'd stop the goading about the earths shape if i were you.

Only you see flatearther. You would have no idea that whatI had posted had any relation to you unless you'd seen it. Not only are you a conspiracy theorist tool and a homophobe, you're also a liar. Just keep on exposing those wonderful character traits you have.

He's there again tailgating. Your stalking is sick....

So is your homophobic nature, your lying and your disrespect of the dead. Bit of alowlife really.

Jingle bells, jingle bells
The Butcher's got three names
Oh what fun he stalks all day shifting ego's to play his game.

From the butcher to JLM
the sicko switches again, and again
God knows what the 3rd name is
that it could be dirty den. YO !

Among the first responses one usually hears whenever the question of conspiracy arises is: how is it possible for so many people to stay so silent for so long?

I like to give three good examples - the cases of John F. Kennedy, Robert F. Kennedy & Martin Luther King.

The first of the trio is particularly relevant since we have recently passed the 50th anniversary of that murder. Throughout the year there were as many as three dozen films, documentaries and major print media pieces devoted to what took place in Dealey Plaza.

When quizzed on the question of "Who killed JFK?" most people respond in one of two ways. Either they believe the official explanation (Lee Harvey Oswald did it) or there was a conspiracy involving X, Y & Z.

But this is completely bizarre because the OFFICIAL explanation, delivered in the late seventies by the House Select Committee on Assassinations, is that Oswald was most probably involved in a conspiracy. Since Bill Clinton signed the JFK Records Act into law following the furore kicked up by Oliver Stone's movie, "JFK", it's now possible to all but completely rule Oswald out entirely.

This begs two important questions - if (at the very least) Oswald was officially recognised as being one member of a conspiracy to kill the President - why does the mainstream media continue to uphold the findings of the Warren Commission (a verdict which is no longer valid)? Even more importantly - if Oswald was part of a conspiracy why, in the FORTY YEARS since the HSCA, have there been NO EFFORTS WHATSOEVER to track down and arrest his accomplices? We're not talking about the robbery of the school tuck-shop here - this is one of the biggest crimes of the century!

Which brings us nicely to Martin Luther King. Now, the King case is nowhere near as high-profile as JFK ("why?", is an interesting question for another debate). Ask most people to name King's killer and you'll be lucky to find 5% who'll respond with the name, "James Earl Ray". Virtually NO-ONE is aware of the fact that in the late nineties the King family won a major civil trial (in Memphis, no less!) at the end of which the jury decided that King was assassinated by agents acting on behalf of the United States Government and involving members of the local police department working in conjunction with the mob, FBI and military intelligence. The entire court transcript can be found on the Martin Luther King website (a decision which cost the family dearly, I might add). Throughout the trial NOT ONE of the major news channels or newspapers even bothered to send a reporter. After the verdict was read NOT ONE local or federal law enforcement body bothered to investigate the court's findings.

Now on to the case of Robert F. Kennedy. Like the King case, few people know the name of RFK's killer, Sirhan Sirhan. Unlike the JFK & King cases - even conspiracy theorists don't doubt that Sirhan Sirhan was present when RFK was murdered and that he fired a gun. So what's the issue? Well, it turns out that of the three cases I've listed proving the existence of a conspiracy is the easiest for RFK. Of the ninety or so eye-witnesses to the RFK killing every single one of them placed Sirhan Sirhan immediately in front of Kennedy. The exact distance is hotly debated. Some say as little as two feet. Some say as far as ten feet. But everyone agrees that Sirhan Sirhan was ONLY EVER in front of Kennedy. Yet in arguably the most exhaustive post-mortem report ever conducted (described by perhaps the finest American forensic scientist of the last fifty years, Cyril Wecht as "the best he's seen"icon_wink.gif, the equally esteemed California pathologist, Thomas Naguchi, stated that Kennedy was shot at "point blank range" and "from behind".

Did the California police department attempt to find this second gunman? On the contrary - they tried to sack their own pathologist!

What are we to make of the above? Is it conceivable that neither the media nor the various branches of law enforcement are aware of these facts? Is it conceivable that they believe it's no longer all that important to pursue the accomplices of the man who murdered one of the greatest presidents in American history, or those members of the government who plotted to kill the most famous and influential American civil rights leader - a man who was practically beatified last year?

I mean, I'm a pretty open minded individual - but if this is not convincing evidence of not just major conspiracy, but major conspiracy carried out in conjunction with ALL elements of government and the mainstream media I really don't know what is.

I'm always fascinated to hear what people think CIA Director, Richard Helms, [imeant[/i when he said he had nearly a thousand active agents working in TV, print journalism and academia at the HSCA in 1978? Do they think the CIA just pays them for sitting there and doing nothing? Bear in mind this number has probably quadrupled today with all the spending that has been ploughed into covert activities.

I'm actually cringing for you. What a genuinely odd, weird man you really are.

It was those 3 killings, JFK, RFK and MLK (along with the JFK film) that really started me looking at such things from a different perspective.
It wasn't that I really researched the 3 killings in depth it's just that with all of them, but especially John & Robert Kennedy, things just didn't seem right and didn't seem to add up in the way we were told they should.
And then when you look at the 3 and add in the lies about Vietnam it starts to make sense in a bigger perspective.
But really it was JFK and I can remember vividly the first time I saw the zapruder film. I saw the film before I knew that much about it all and so just instantly assumed that the book depository was in front of Kennedy. When I found out it was behind I just couldn't understand how anyone, or any investigation, could think the final shot didn't come from the front.
Then of course the more I looked into it the more I found that didn't add up too.

Like Bren, I don't believe that everything is a conspiracy or hoax, I look at the evidence people put out and decide for myself, but I'm much more likely to believe them now than I was before JFK came out and it inspired me to look into it. And much much more suspicious of the media and its motives.

I think we could all, regardless of our views on conspiracies, agree on how biased and awful the media is.
Regardless of anyone's politics on here, the biased nature and sometimes outright made up nature of some recent stories in the media should concern everyone. The 2 that come to mind recently are the ones about Jeremy Corbyn at the cenotaph and The Sun making up the 1-in-5 Muslims, and their reporter lying about not having his ID checked when getting into Europe.

If they can do that to further their own agendas then they can do anything.

I've just watched the Garrison tapes on the unmediated history thread, what es me off is that there's so many theories regarding the killer shot. I believe the PTB invent alternative theories up and try to throw any keen researcher off the scent of what really happened, and that leads the researcher becoming puzzled and confused which can lead to a doubtful mind-set which the PTB set out to intend in the first place which is a type of mind control. At the end of the day the CIA's involvement in this case is so overwhelming it's stinks to high heaven. The CIA have a free role in society they're free to assassinate at free-will which is another subject with regard's of whom they've taken out, the list is endless.

This could be a great thread with lots of discussion from both sides but Flat Stanley just keeps on ruining it

Regards

King James

It'd be even better if you could contribute more than a sentence to the topic.

Regards

Flat Stanley

Some weeks ago before his previous persona got itself banned, I asked our dissembling friend a simple question: Why - if as he insists, the Earth is flat - does the Moon look 'upside down' from Australia .

It must be the hardest question in the world though for our Stanley, as one thing he will not do is directly answer it. There is no point in moving on to harder questions with someone who can't or won't respond to a simple straightforward question. Bearing in mind he raised the "flat earth" lunacy, not me.

You can learn a lot from his assertion that asking this very simple and un-loaded question is "goading". Although when his brain can't compute a reply, I suppose maybe it feels like it to poor Stan.

You have to laugh, though, at his vainglorious threat to spam the board. How arrogantly crass! Knock yourself out mate - spam as much as you want! Do you nuttily believe that the forum admins would be incapable of dealing with such asinine behaviour? I bet you do!

Take your puerile threatening post and stick it up yer jacksy.

And - answer the question.

I would've thought that the more likely question would be: how is it [iplausible[/i for so many people to stay so silent for so long?

Your suggestion that the government, intelligence services, federal and local law enforcement, the judiciary [iand[/i the media are co-conspirators is very difficult to take seriously; we're talking about hundreds of disparate individuals within very separate and distinct organisations - organisations who are often in opposition to each other - who have somehow got together at a lodge meeting and, over a secret handshake, agreed to conspire against the general public; and who appear to have done it not just once, but multiple times, and with great success.

Again - I point to the monological belief system theory; once you've convinced yourself that the above is possible, it becomes, as Psychologist Michael J. Wood described it, "the default explanation for any given event—a unitary, closed-off worldview in which beliefs come together in a mutually supportive network known as a monological belief system."

Firstly are you male or female or a child maybe ? i can't really work out the gender of your topsy turvy vitriolic abuse. Obviously knowing what gender you are i'd reply in a manner thats appropriate i reckon you're youthful so i'll treat you like one, great.

Secondly,just to let everybody know i'm again being challenged and goaded into a Geocentric debate, which obviously differs to the topic we're currently debatimg, I don't wish to divert this thread, If you want to debate me in the night sky thread it seems a perfect place to discuss this topic, i'd be willing divulge the globe conspiracy in there but i can guarentee you'll go crying to the mods again getting my posts deleted again because you cannot prove the spinning ball.

I'd love to have this debate regarding geocentrism it's my passion however its like debating with nursery kids the mud-slinging just over weigh's the debate, also the same old problem keeps arising. The previous debates i proved Geocentrism, and i could repeat, repeat and repeat more evidence and you'd continue your childish mud-slinging. I had you crying to the Mod's last time and i had post's removed which was also unfair and now your at it again trying to instigate a position of counjouring support against me and my differing views.

With regard to Australia's moon being semi circled upside down, it's a very simple answer to a very simple question, asked by a very simple person. It's all about perspective for example, If you for instance sit in the south east corner of your sitting room and use your lounge light as the moon imagine it being semi circled from upside down, where you're sat is Australia, now go and sit in the facing opposite corner the North West of the room we'll call that area Saudi Arabia to which you would observe the moon being semi circular from the top. It's all about perspective's which obviously you don't understand yet.

Now i've answered your repeated question i have countless video evdence which i didn't want to use or expose on this thread. I have a million and one decent questions to ask you about the bile that NASA dish out which i know you haven't got a cat in hell's chance of answering. i've a library of disinformation to expose but the ficticious Night Sky seems the best thread to dish this out not this one nice try child. All you have to do invite me to your ficticious thread but i'd wager a bout of childish goading followed by more mud slinging, then i'd ask myself is it really worth it, and to be honest i don't really think it is. I think the best option for me is to stay away from childish vitriol bull and use the old gracious Foe Button.

Back on topic

[url=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3351684/Alleged-jihadi-tourist-caught-stash-gun-training-videos-returning-Syria-paid-MI5-helper.htmllNormally this would be classed as a CONSPIRACY[/url

Alleged jihadi tourist caught with a stash of gun training videos after returning from Syria 'was a paid MI5 helper'

Police discovered terror-related material at the south London home of Muslim convert Mustafa Abdullah, 34, after seizing his mobile phone when he landed in the UK last year, it was heard.

Giving evidence in his defence, Abdullah said he first became involved with the British security service between January and August 2008.

His lawyer Andrew Hill asked: 'What was the purpose of the contact?'

The father-of-four replied: 'Basically, they were saying, "can you spy for us?". I said Muslims don't spy, however, I will assist you. I don't hang around with people like that but if I do, I will let you know.'

Abdullah told jurors he was paid £10,000, adding: 'I didn't need the money but they wanted to give it, so I took it.'

Three months before he went to Syria, MI5 agent 'Graham' called him up and asked for a meeting, but he rebuffed him, the defendant said.

£10.000 of your money

I've just come across this article, here a former CIA, NSA agent Steve D Kelley speaks out regarding the St Bernardino False flag event. Steve's declares "expect a long line of more false flagged events . “The people that were on the scene and saw this happen also reported that three tall white men wearing black shirts, khaki pants and tanned combat boots were actually the shooters. The description is almost exactly what the gentlemen from Craft International, the mercenary organization that was involved in so many other false flags, actually look like. This seems to be their standard uniform,”
[url=http://presstv.com/Detail/2015/12/08/440834/Craft-International-mercenaries-San-Bernardino-shootingFULL ARTICLE AND VIDEO INTERVIEW CLICK[/url

I only replied to the previous post as is my right of reply, given the abuse you had aimed directly at me. I reply only for the same reason.

My post under reply contained - Vitriol: zero. Abuse: zero.


Not even a bit. I am simply pointing out one fact, that you were asked one simple question, which you won't answer.As for "geocentric debate", there IS no debate. The evidence is so overwhelming and the flatearthism so mind-numbingly unscientific and frankly mad, that it doesn't qualify for a "debate" any more than fairies at the bottom of the garden do.

You don't have any intention to debate, because you can't debate. You can't answer the simplest question.


You see, you can't just answer a straight question. You feel compelled to lace whatever drivel you write with antagonistic, sneering, nasty bullcrap. This says a lot about you.

Second, your bizarre "example" doesn't work. Wherever I sit in my room, the "semicircle" will always be pointing the same way. I will (obviously) se it from a different perspective, but its up-down orientation (obviously) doesn't change. At all. From anywhere in the room.

Anyway, the moon is a sphere, not a crescent. Make you room light a simple sphere. Paint a big red spot on the bottom. The spot will be at the bottom whether viewed from ANY part of the room.

In the case of the moon, it isn't a featureless sphere. It has well known topography. You can see, from anywhere on the planet, which part to you from where you are viewing looks "up". It isn't a question of illumination. What I see as the "top" of the moon would look to me as the "bottom" of the moon if I moved to Australia.


The thing is, you haven't. At all. Your example is very plain nonsense. Anyone can see through it in a second. Indeed, unless you are insane - which I doubt - you must very well know your "example" is nonsense. This is what my problem is with you. It strongly indicates that nothing you say is to be taken sremotely seriously. I mean, you cannot possibly actually believe that a room lamp will invert itself, or appear inverted, from different ends of a room. Can you?


Excuse me? You know i haven't a chance of answering questiuons you haven't asked? Are you now claiming to be psychic to add to the rest?

If that were true, you could always start your own thread and pose your stunning questions. If any were interesting, people might even choose to engage them.


...isn't fictitious at all. the nice thing is anyone can view it, clear sky permitting, from anywhere on the globe. That is your insurmountable problem.


One of us continually posts threats and abuse and one of us doesn't. Your problem is you actually can't stand calm, rational discussion.

Do catch the ISS on its numerous (predictable) passes this next few days. While you're at it, maybe you could plot its path on a map of your "flat earth" and explain how the feck it does that

Didn't he tell you that he lies down first?
He lies in one corner raises his head and looks at the light bulb.
It is hanging down, with Osram written on the bottom.

He then slides on his to the opposite corner without changing the direction of his feet until they hit the wall.
He now looks back. Hey presto, the bulb is hanging up with Osram written on the top.
Case proven.
He of course hasn't realised in effect he has turned upside down.
Oh silly him!
Shall I put a bank of three laughing emoticons?
It seems to be the trend.

I'know exactly what you've written, it'll be vitriolic CHILDISH nonsense. followed by a load of heliocentric bull even though i can't see it due to the beauty of the Foe button. Hmmm Bliss