Brown was never PM material IMO. Still a better one that Cameron when it comes to diplomacy though.

Really not sure why you think I'd be interested in anything from the Socialist Worker. Or is everyone who disagrees with Call Me Dave now a raving lefty in your book? Bit disappointed by that comment TBH.

I read the article. Your interpretation of it doesn't agree with mine. It's also pretty clear from various sources on the web that Blair's deal did, in fact, have a material impact on the %age of the EU budget that was spent on the CAP. Not because the CAP was renegotiated, but because of the new distribution of funding. Blair's deal was also given the green light by the guy that Call Me Dave has just appointed as his ambassador to the EU. Go figure.

I find it difficult to believe that you genuinely think that Cameron is as good a [idiplomat[/i as Blair. The evidence so far is pretty comprehensively against it. No matter what you think about the EU - and I'm no fan of the current structure - being on the outside looking in is not in the UK's best interest.

Quote ="Ajw71"Cameron shoots ahead in the polls. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16175503'" Milliband is doing a limp, ineffective job in opposition. as the article states: the last few weeks have seen Osborne deliver grim economic news, a public sector strike, a controversial EU veto, and now worsening unemployment figures...and yet its the Tory's that get the boost in the polls. I bet their will be a big re-think on strategy for Labour, as their current 'tactics' just aren't working.

Quote ="Ajw71"Cameron shoots ahead in the polls. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16175503'" Milliband is doing a limp, ineffective job in opposition. as the article states: the last few weeks have seen Osborne deliver grim economic news, a public sector strike, a controversial EU veto, and now worsening unemployment figures...and yet its the Tory's that get the boost in the polls. I bet their will be a big re-think on strategy for Labour, as their current 'tactics' just aren't working.

Quote ="UllFC" Quote ="Ajw71"Cameron shoots ahead in the polls. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16175503'" Milliband is doing a limp, ineffective job in opposition. as the article states: the last few weeks have seen Osborne deliver grim economic news, a public sector strike, a controversial EU veto, and now worsening unemployment figures...and yet its the Tory's that get the boost in the polls. I bet their will be a big re-think on strategy for Labour, as their current 'tactics' just aren't working.'" I guess it balances things out when the worst PM for an age is countered by the worst opposition leader in a similar period. Definitely looks like Labour chose the wrong brother.

Quote ="UllFC" Quote ="Ajw71"Cameron shoots ahead in the polls. www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-16175503'" Milliband is doing a limp, ineffective job in opposition. as the article states: the last few weeks have seen Osborne deliver grim economic news, a public sector strike, a controversial EU veto, and now worsening unemployment figures...and yet its the Tory's that get the boost in the polls. I bet their will be a big re-think on strategy for Labour, as their current 'tactics' just aren't working.'" I guess it balances things out when the worst PM for an age is countered by the worst opposition leader in a similar period. Definitely looks like Labour chose the wrong brother.

Labour shouldn't have even been thinking about those two, they should have been putting all their efforts into persuading Alan Johnson his future lay as leader.

After catching that rozzer nobbing his missus, I doubt he'd be up for the job mate.

My guess on the next (as in sooner rather than later) Labour leader would be 'no-balls Balls' - Yvette Cooper

Brown was not only a disgrace as PM but a disaster as Chancellor....

as for Milliband....



I despair of the Labour Party...



as for Cameron and his fellow 'upper class twit of the year' Osborne.......

I think Brown got a harsh deal as PM. Blair stepped down just as things were about to get ugly, and whoever inherited that particular sandwich was going to struggle. I don't agree with everything (or even most things) Brown said or did, but I do think he had far more integrity than Cameron.

Played a blinder did Blair, had Brown knocking on his bedroom door every morning for five years like a kid asking if it was christmas yet and was it today that he gets to be Prime Minister as promised, and all the while Blair was riding the wave until the last minute when he, but no-one else, could see it all starting to fall down - "Here's the keys Gordon, I've not left a forwarding address..."

seems sad that the UK is lacking real parlementarians of the old school like (love 'em or loath 'em) Iain Macleod,Michael Foot,Enoch Powell and the ageing Tony Benn et al

the present lot appear to be a bunch of namby pamby plonkers...from all parties !

sorry,missed out John Smith...

They are around but they are not as young and photogenic as the ones we see on TV everyday, there is no way someone like John Smith would be a party leader today, his image just wouldn't fit.

maybe but Iain Macleod is spoken by many as the best PM Britain never had...and John Smith has been given similar acolades over the years
i'm not a Bennite (or any other 'ite') but he and Powell and Foot all with differing perspectives had so many intelligent things to say ! and were not frightened to say it.
Todays' politicians just seem too frightened to come out with anything other than political rhetoric and party-line bilge...no body wants to come out and say what they REALLY think in fear of being called Politically Incorrect or whatever the current term is.
at least Jean-Marie le Pen had the b@lls to say what he thought though this has ben somewhat toned down by his daughter unfortunately...

It's a sad reflection on politics in the UK when the 'best' we can muster as party leaders are Milliband, Clegg, and Cameron. Not a statesman among them.

that's the problem

I don't think it's just the UK. Look at Berlusconi or Sarkozy. Even Obama has been much less effective on the international stage than his campaign promised. Though when you look at some of the Republican candidates for the US Presidency, he looks positively awe-inspiring by comparison.

yeh,definitely a world wide thing - I can't recall a real french statesman since De Gaulle,Giscard,Barre and Pompidou
France seems full of sh@t stirrers like Cohn Bendit but not much else - Sarko is probably as outspoken as they come which is a sad endightment on french politics...

that's why the floating voter is seriously considering Marine le Pen as an alternative.....

Who needs statesmen, when we're gradually handing over the keys of power to unelected bankers?

cynical,but probably true......

We can see it quite specifically in Greece and Italy, and I don't think many other decisions being made by governments across Europe today are being made without recourse to what finance wants.

As I've mentioned, while I do think Cameron's decision to keep the UK out of the proposed deal was the right one, I very much doubt that it was made for what I'd consider the right decisions, but instead, to keep happy his friends in the City.

Election campaigns, battle buses and private jets don't fund themselves - I believe the phrase is "you've got to dance with them that brought you".

Well indeed – anyone remember who funded Andrew Lansley?

I guess you are referring to the perfectly respectable donations to his election fund by a chap who was on the board of a private medical company?
No conflict of interest there surely?

To be fair to Blair, if Brown didnt see it coming then who would?

I thought Brown did a good job in the wake of Lehmans, but it was astonishing the way that he genuinely did seem to have believed his guff about ending boom and bust.

Unfortunately I thought his integrity died along with the 10p tax rate.

not to mention the electorate of course......

Edited for clarity.